Member: paul m
Location: oh
Date: 4/30/01
Time: 7:50:44 AM
Hi, I'm Paul and an alcoholic. What I love about AA is the fact that I don't have to follow some rigid set of rules. I have always been a bit of a non-conformist. This tradition allows us the freedom, thru group conscious, to run our meetings as we see fit. In my area, most of the meetings are pretty much ran the same way, yet I have been in meetings in differant states that the format is totally differant, but thats ok. Our founders in their wisdom determined long ago that we can't stay sober alone. If we don't like a particular meeting we can attend a differant one or start our own meeting. With the 4th tradition, and the "independance" it offers, we can find what we need.
Member: Donnie M(dos3-1-99)
Location: W.Va.
Date: 4/30/01
Time: 8:23:56 AM
Hi, to all I`m Donnie and i`m a alcoholic. This tradition is a good one cause it simply say`s if two or more people what to talk about recovery and call it a meeting than it is and to me these are the best group`s going. I was once told that there is three meeting`s I must make a day that is the one before the meeting , during the meeting, and after the meeting. Doing this open`s you up to the fellowship and some really good and bad stuff come`s out , but you only need to take what advise that help`s you and leave the rest for other`s, so if you have the desire to pick up call or write somebody else in recovery and start a meeting. Thank`s for letting me share and GOD BLESS TO ALL.
Member: Pam B
Location: Daytona Beach, FL
Date: 4/30/01
Time: 12:05:36 PM
Hi, I'm Pam, an alcoholic, I understood "autonomous" a lot better after I'd gone thru the 12 Steps in the Coda Program & learned how to apply being autonomous to my own self as an individual. It means not being "dependant upon" others for the things I am to take responsibility for my own self, relying on my HP for direction, guidance & ability to do so, along with the wisdom & experience & suggestions of those who have gone before me passing on their ES&H. This is not "in-dependant" but being "non-dependant" in harmony & unison with others, working together, helping one another, sharing, keeping the "we" - but not in a way that I am depending on anyone else to do for me as I am to do for my own self, nor depending on people, places & things outside my own self for how I am. Then this made simple sense that each group functions as responsible for itself, not dependant on any other groups. Thanks for letting me share. Pam
Member: Sarah
Location: NW USA
Date: 4/30/01
Time: 4:44:58 PM
Autonomous....It states in the 12 x 12 that the traditions were first published in 1946. Today 'we' can come to this 'cyber meeting' any time day or night from any computer on this planet earth with the guarentee that there will be a meeting of a 'group of drunks' sharing their experience, strength and hope. Thanks AA!
Member: baker
Location: Canada
Date: 4/30/01
Time: 7:15:07 PM
Hi there I`m not much of a traditions man, only so far as that they govern groups of people who keep me sober.When I first came into AA I thought words like (anonamouse)and(autonomouse)were drunk tests,and when I could pronounce, and spell them I would be all better as you can see I have a way to go.
Keep Trudging
Member: Michael B.
Location: AZ
Date: 4/30/01
Time: 10:23:43 PM
Hi! My name is Michael, and I am a recovering alcoholic and addict, sober today only by the Grace of God and the Fellowship. Welcome newcomers! Thanks for the genuine shares!
The ability to be autonomous allows each group the flexibility to shape itself according to its membership, as long as the group membership sticks to the primary purpose of staying sober and helping other alcoholics achieve sobriety.
Deviating from the primary purpose of AA groups and failing to abide by the Traditions and principles of the AA program within the context of autonomy invokes the Tradition Four caveat, "except in matters affecting other groups or AA as a whole."
This Tradition and its caveat also apply to AA service bodies as well.
Member: Adam H.
Location: Nagano, JAPAN
Date: 4/30/01
Time: 10:56:41 PM
Adam, alcoholic.
Rule #62 ("Just don't take yourself so damn seriously.") comes from this Tradition, and recently I got a really good lesson about it. I was part of the committee that was putting together an open speakers' meeting in East Nagano. Now, as I have said before, most people in my neck of the woods do not make it into AA until a doctor forces you in. Hence, a majority of the executive committee thought it would be a good idea to invite a doctor from a local asylum to come and speak. Well, being the good AA that I am (ahem...), I reminded the group that this was a meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous, even if it was open speakers, that we place principles before personalities, and that the focus of any meeting should be about the Steps. Would you believe the meeting actually divided into debating teams about this? And of course I was right in there with them, acting like a damned AA-know-it-all. Oh, the petty resentments and sick actions that followed were ugly, and I ended up not going to meetings for a while. Bad move for an AA member!
It wasn't until I re-read Tradition 4 (at my sponsor's urging) that I was reminded that every group has the right to be wrong, and that they were free to learn the hard way about what a mistake this was going to be. It was so hard to stand back and let the group do as they pleased, but I had to remember that there was an authority for that group and that it was a loving God, not me. So I stood back and stopped arguing....damn, that was hard because I knew I was right! Well, as it turned out, an exec committee member went to another open speakers' meeting in another part of Japan where they DID end up inviting the doctor to speak and consequently heard a bunch of alcoholics wishing they had never come to the meeting. And because I was no longer raising hell by telling the group what was right and what was not, we--the entire executive committe--came to a PEACEFUL decision to not invite a doctor. That must have been God working...and I learned once again not to take myself too seriously.
Grateful to be here and sober.
Member: Jack B
Location: Palo Alto, Pa
Date: 5/1/01
Time: 2:41:18 AM
Hi I am Jack a real alcoholic.When I think of tradition four I think of my homegroup.We are a basic AA group, we meet five days a week at noon.We have a begineers meeting on Monday where we basically stick to the first three steps.Tuesday, Thursday and Friday are open discussion meetings.On Wednesday we have a closed step meeting. Our group pretty much sticks to the only real topics for A A.God, Alcohol and Program.We are one of the best supported groups attendance wise in District 58.We got that way from attraction, not promotion. We are there for sobriety and beyond, and that is what I feel has kept us going for many many years while other groups have folded.We carry the message of Alcoholics Anonymous, we know we are but messengers of the Big Book, not it's author. For my home group, The Came to Believe Group in St Clair Pa, which I believe is the best homegroup in District 58 we adhere to the basics of A A.The twelve steps are how it works, the twelve traditions are why it works. Thanks for allowing me to share and God Bless.
Member: AnilG
Location: Mt Vernon,IL
Date: 5/1/01
Time: 6:57:55 AM
I am an alcoholic and an addict I like this tradition because of the simplicity and autonomy. These group do not have to depend upon the support of others or funding from others sources. The only requirement is to stop drinking and suport others in there recovery,
Member: lsr
Location:
Date: 5/1/01
Time: 3:51:36 PM
What's ES&H?
Member: to LSR
Location:
Date: 5/1/01
Time: 4:57:18 PM
ES&H= experience, strength, and hope
Member: craZY DAN
Location:
Date: 5/2/01
Time: 9:40:39 PM
do you think donald trump would GIVE me some money?i sure could use some.
Member: patg
Location: Tucson
Date: 5/3/01
Time: 2:46:04 AM
Dan, if he does get some for me too. The seventh step says if God could remove my obsession which he did who am I to doubt he can remove other difficulties so I'm sticking around for the next miracle. And believe me I need a miracle. But nevertheless I am grateful to be sober today - on Friday it will be six months.
Member: patg
Location: Tucson
Date: 5/3/01
Time: 2:46:41 AM
Dan, if he does get some for me too. The seventh step says if God could remove my obsession which he did who am I to doubt he can remove other difficulties so I'm sticking around for the next miracle. And believe me I need a miracle. But nevertheless I am grateful to be sober today - on Friday it will be six months.
Member: Von
Location: Ohio
Date: 5/3/01
Time: 4:30:48 PM
Maybe it's just me because I'm visiting from work, but I don't think the 4th Tradition says "other groups of AA as a whole" but should read "other groups OR AA as a whole".
The most important thing to me is to get the tradition right before trying to understand it. For sure I know that the traditions are a quiet bunch, but very powerful because I believe that they have helped to keep AA the way it is today.
The fourth tradition is so important because of the number of preferences and opinions AA's have. If one group needed permission from the Central Office to switch from donuts to cookies, we would spend needless time discussing matters that don't make too much difference in the big picture.
If, however, a group wanted to buy an hour of radio time to broadcast their meeting and "market" their meeting, that would obviously affect other groups or AA as a whole (not to mention violating other traditions). I hope you get the point.
If Central Office decided to tell all groups in its territory that they could no longer sign papers, that would affect some groups who might help a person who would have never heard of AA unless they were court appointed. This was my start.
So the group autonomy works both ways. It allows a group to carry the AA message as best they can, and it allows them to make decisions to meet the needs of its particular members. It also prevents a group from stepping it's bounds and making decisions that can adversely affect other groups whether intended or not.
The quote that comes to mind:
"The traditions protect the fellowship from the membership".
God Bless.
Member: dan
Location: still broke
Date: 5/5/01
Time: 1:40:16 PM
pat g,
ill do my best..............if i cant get a
nickle out of the cheap bastard,ill try jay leno!!!!!