Member: Meme
Location: Herehere
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 09:26 AM

Comments

How about NOT finding a stupid sponsor to worship like an idol?? I've been sober a long time and haven't had a sponsor for a long time and don't plan on gettin one for an even longer time!!!!!!!!!


Member:
Location:
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 09:50 AM

Comments

It shows by your writing and attitude


Member: Mike H
Location: Jackson MI
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 10:16 AM

Comments

Mike, alcoholic. When I first came into the program I was confused, hurt, angry, and knew nothing about the program. By the grace of my HP I met someone that could take the time to show me the ropes and help me to understand.Call this person a friend, mentor, sponsor, or whatever. At present I don't have a sponsor but I have a few close friends in the program that I trust. I had to decide certain things such as trust,knowledge of the program, lifestyle, easy to talk to, etc. If I don't have someone to talk to about certain things safely then I am lost and bound to drink again. I feel support is the key(whatever a person is comfortable with). One day at a time.


Member:
Location:
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 10:16 AM

Comments

Ahhhh. and yours is soooo much better, right? According to who, yourself? I'm more happy, joyous, and free than you could ever dream of being...........


Member:
Location:
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 10:17 AM

Comments

Ahhhh. and yours is soooo much better, right? According to who, yourself? I'm more happy, joyous, and free than you could ever dream of being...........And ALL WITHOUT a so-called sponsor!


Member:
Location:
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 10:18 AM

Comments

I can't wait 'till Carlc sees this topic.<<<<<<<LOL>>>>>>>>>


Member: mariab
Location: north florida
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 10:26 AM

Comments

I would like to have a sponsor because this fight is so lonely. Of course, it is hard to know whether the person is centered and stable enough to truly be helpful. And it is a big commitment on their part, isn't it? Everyone is so busy these days. I have a good friend out of state who sort of serves as my sponsor--via email. It's not the same for the times when those insane urges to buy alcohol overcome me, but it he has been successful in rebuilding his life, which was basically entirely shattered by alcohol, and remain sober for over ten years. Isn't it true that alcoholics often are overly independent, thinking they can control life (ha) and scared to be honest and ask for help. This is Mariab, I had two beers last night (my roomate bought beer and I got left alone in the house with the Siren's Song. sigh. Today is a new day and I am trying to take heart from the posts that say DON'T FEEL GUILTY.


Member: Melissa
Location: Canada
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 12:35 PM

Comments

Yes, I think it's common that active alcoholics are often overly dependant or overly dominant. (Tell me how to do everything/I'm not listening to anything ANYone says). I would probably have fallen into the dependant category except my sponsor (mentor, mostly friend) wouldn't let me. She made it clear that she was simply a sober woman who'd made some progress in the program of AA. She helped with practical things like telling me WHY I was suddenly craving chocolate bars, and bursting into tears for no apparent reason. She helped me with identifying feelings, (I couldn't; if you asked me how I was, I would tell you how my husband and children were). She explained things like the seventh tradition (where the money goes) and what an 'outside issue' was. When I repeated something someone had said in a meeting, complete with name, she let me know that this wasn't how it worked (since it wasn't a malicious thing, I figured it was okay). She answered about a million questions when she could, and said "I don't know" when she couldn't. After awhile, I started figuring out that the idea wasn't for me to grow into "her" but for me to grow into me. She was pretty available, but not enough that I could count on getting hold of her and that forced me to get to know other women, which was a blessing. She helped a lot, but in no way let me crawl into her lap and be taken care of. Looking back, she really did support me until I could start to stand, with some confidence, on my own feet. I sponsor the way I was sponsored, pretty much, not totally, because I have to be very mindful of not "fixing" people, and sometimes I go overboard trying not to "fix". I've lost more than one sponsee because I haven't been the right person for that woman, and that's the way it goes sometimes. I remember one woman paid me the ultimate compliment of being honest with me when she said she wanted me to do all the work for her and because I wouldn't (couldn't) she didn't want me as a sponsor anymore. The biggest thing my sponsor was to me was being the very first person in my whole life that I didn't lie to, bullshit, or people-please with. When I let her see the so-called "real" Melissa and she didn't walk away in disgust (or worse, boredom) that opened great wide doors for me, and I began learning to trust myself, which had a pretty incredible domino effect in the rest of my life. It took time, and I didn't get away with never feeling angry at my sponsor (always because she wasn't "doing enough" for me) but, holy heaven, what a valuable relationship, and how it changed me, and my life. Long post. Thanks for listening. Love and encouragement to all the newcomers.


Member: L-RAY
Location: SCOTLAND
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 02:18 PM

Comments

I found my sponser at a meeting i used to go to and joined he was a kind man and very understanding and did lots of 12 step work, so i wanted what he had and i asked if he would and he said yes that was 16+ years ago and we are good friends to-day and he is 71 now and 29 years sober hes a great guy and i love him dearly , Regards L-RAY


Member: Pamela
Location: ILLINOIS
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 02:46 PM

Comments

Illinois Pamela here, alcoholic. ((Mariab)) I too live in a house where alcohol is stored. It's cooking sherry and I found it by accident but I have decided that when I reach into that cabinet for the flour or corn oil that I am going to ignore it. I even thought of asking the person whose house I'm staying in to sstore it somewhere else. But that's unrealistic-- alcohol and the opportunities to buy it are everywhere and as long as I don't go out of my way to come into contact with people, places, or things that will bring me into unnecessary contact that I can with the help of my HP avoid drinking it. Just wanted to let you know how I dealt with that situation in my expeerience. Back to topic: good sponsorship--A sponsor to me would be someone whose program I've observed and it works sucessfully for them. I would choose a sponsor whose life experience had been similar to mine and who had some of the same interests and hobbies so that we could both have a common frame of reference. A good sponsor is sort of like a guide or someone who will occasionally come check on you or look briefly over your shoulder to give you a couple of pointers and then move on. Personally, I could not have a domineering sponsor.


Member: Kerry C
Location: Texas
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 03:04 PM

Comments

Kerry here an alcoholic. Hmmm Finding a sponsor...good topic. The idea of sponsorship was in the beginning to get a person acquainted with the basics of AA while they were detoxing in the hospital prior to attending their first AA meeting. Sort of to get them started on the right path. Since then sponsorship has taken every imaginable direction and meaning. I agree that many sponsors are just ego maniacs thinking they are AA deities. In my view a good sponsor will sponsor as one way of working Step 12, carrying the message to other alcoholics, and ackowledge that they need the sponsee more than the sponsee needs them for their own sobriety. I used my home AA group as a sponsor for the first couple of months while I decided who had what I wanted and asked him to be my sponsor. I looked for someone that worked their program in the simple form that the first 100 AAers used as outlined in the Big Book. I view my sponsor as a teacher/guide to learn the program as written in the book. My sponsor only suggests things that he is also willing to do/doing. I need a sponsor because left to my own devices is what landed me in the mess I was in when I came to AA. If my thinking was so great and my mind so wonderful why was my life so messed up? I need to bounce ideas off of someone not personally attached to my problems as I am. I certainly shouldn't expect to be able to solve the problem with the very thing that created the problem; my mind. Another thing that I keep firmly planted in my thoughts is that my sponsor is human and therefore not perfect. That is why I keep God as the single most important part of my recovery.


Member: I
Location: HERE
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 03:31 PM

Comments

I love it the name says it all MEME you can do it your way.Thats the way but I think if someone asked you to be their sponsor.Your head would would get even BIGGER. BUT LIKE THEY SAY TAKE WHAT YOU NEED AND LEAVE THE REST


Member: MARK M
Location: COLUMBIA TN
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 03:40 PM

Comments

mark m here alcoholic only one thing to say GET A SPONSOR!!! HEY TO YOU MIKE H


Member: Jane C.
Location: Alaska
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 04:43 PM

Comments

Hi, Jane C here again...I had a sponser years ago that I thought was right for me...I was wrong..I needed help with agoraphobia and went into group therapy...she FIRED me as they say because she didn't believe in any counseling or therapy This hurt a lot..and since then I found for me that having close friends in AA that I can talk to is works better..and doesn't the BB tell us to get counsedling when it's needed ? Didn't the early folks in AA believe in this ?..Since moving here and being new again...I haven't found anyone to talk to about AA other than this site..which I think is a God send...talking here is a good thing for me...Marib..it is so hard to stay away from the drink when it is so close by...I don't keep anything in the house and I stay away from places that sell it when I passa liquor store I ask God to PLEASE let me just go past it... so far it's working...I have again less than a week, but I really fee so much better..and I pray that I get another day...there are also certain parts of town that are a real challange for me...it seems that there are liquor stores just about every 4or 5 doors away from each other...this is a a tourist town with cruise ships pulling in every day and the shopping part of town is so nice place to walk through this time of the year...but I try not to do it often...shame for me works better than guilt..though I can feel both..I try harder though if I feel ashamed that I let myself down when I slip....Maybe guilt and shame are the same thing..I hope you all have a sober Sunday and that God blesses you all...another Alcohoic here, trying to get through the day..


Member: Carlc
Location: nm
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 05:35 PM

Comments

Here we go again. Sponsorship is three things, pomp, worhip, idolatry and at best ass kissing. Today I crawl before no man, the book and the steps taught to me depend on my creator, in the third step I turned my will and my life over to the care of God not another human being, whatever happened to God could and would if he were sought, or there is one who has all power that one is God may you find him NOW. You can find a sponsor at the drop of a hat, hell there are lists all over the place. When ever I hear someone says my sponsor says, it tells me one of two things, this person cant think for themselves or if they dont know shit they can always blame it on their sponsor. Two guys in San Antonio Texas helped me through the book and one told me point blank, I dont want you kissing my ass in meetings because I am just doing my job. Someone please explain to me all this hiring and firing nonsense, the book says Trust God clean house and give FREELY. The word sponsor means to be responsible for, how in the world can another person be responsible for my spiritual journey? That is between me and the MOST HIGH GOD. I have been in AA for over 20 years and I could write a book on all the damage I have seen these self appointed gods do. The book says strenuous work one alcoholic with another was vital to permanent recovery, it also says nothing will insure immunity from drinking like extensive work with another alcoholic, it also says having had the experience yourself (the steps) you can give much valuable advice. I know people who sponsor all kinds of people and have never taken a step in their lives, their are people in AA that arent even alcoholic and are sponsors. The books says God is either everyting or else he is nothing. One of the guys that helped me told me dont walk in front of me I may not want to follow you, dont walk behing me I may not want to lead you, just walk beside me and be my friend. If I can affect just one alcoholic in my lifetime my job in AA will have been done. Sponsors and their sponcees make me ill, it is sad to see grown people kissing ass.


Member: Avid
Location: Lurker
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 06:25 PM

Comments

Go Carl, go Carl, go boy!!!! You da man!!! Yeah!! Right on brother!!! I couldn't agree more my friend, well said........


Member: Cindy
Location:
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 07:18 PM

Comments

I couldn't agree more my friends. Thats what I say about the whole AA thing.God helps them who help themselfs.Just do it yourself thats the only way I can be happy.Everyone knows just don't drink


Member: GOD
Location: UP HERE
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 09:19 PM

Comments

~~~~~~ ~~~~~~ ~~~~~~ ~~~~~~ Carl C You are no power against ME ! You are NOT ME ! Its no easy task I do getting them here. then the likes of you seeking to send them back out there. many to their early deaths. just to fullfill your own selfcentered need to sound important & all knowing? !! I have sponsors planned out waiting for them that {{{{ " I " }}}} get them sober through! Seek ME to reveal the sponsor I have PATIENTLY had waiting for you!! do your steps. give those fears to ME! stop the selfseeking vain glories !! leave these precious one alone !!! {{{{ " I " }}}} HAVE SPOKEN !!! ~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~


Member: here
Location: there
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 09:59 PM

Comments

Would someone kindly poin,also if someone could point out to me where it even mentions the word sponsor in the first 164 pages of the big book.(old edition)I have read and reread the BB with no luck at all in that regards,I also read "How it Works'numerous times and havent found the word sponsor,now before someone gets their knickers in a knot I do have a sponsor and I have sponsored others.


Member:
Location:
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 10:09 PM

Comments

NOWHERE---THAT'S WHERE!!!!!!!!!!!


Member: Kerry C
Location: TX (KerryCtx@hotmail.com)
Date: July 13, 2003
Time: 11:21 PM

Comments

"Would someone kindly poin,also if someone could point out to me where it even mentions the word sponsor in the first 164 pages of the big book." Although it does not mention sponsor in the Big Book, Bill Wilson talks about sponsors in at least 3 articles written for the Grapevine that can be found in the book "Language of the Heart". In the May 1947 issue of the Grapevine, Adequate Hospitalization:One Great Need Bill W. writes this; "More and more, AA groups are adopting the idea of sponsorship. Each newcomer is assigned a reasonably stable AA member whose ward he becomes during his brief period of introduction to our way of life. The sponsor helps make hospital arrangements, takes his man there, visits him frequently, and sees that he is visited by other AAs whose experience might be specially helpful. Hence a prospect so handled has received a powerful shot of AA and a good preview of what our society is like before he ever goes to a meeting." In the June 1966 issue of the Grapevine, In Remembrance of Ebby, Bill W. writes; "In his seventieth year, and on the twenty-first of March, my friend and sponsor Ebby passed beyond our sight and hearing." There is at least one more reference to sponsorship that I have read but can't find it currently. In that article Bill describes a sponsors responsibility to the new man to let him know he is sponsoring him for his own sobriety sake. Given a choice I chose to rely on Bill Wilsons word above the so called experts that post against sponsorship. If it was good enough for Bill Wilson it is good enough for me...


Member: Becca
Location: California
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 01:39 AM

Comments

Wow, this has been an interesting read. Sponsorship? Hmmmm. I'm new to the program and I do have a sponser. I got one my first week in AA. I did however, have the bubble burst that she wasn't perfect and that she couldn't save me. It hurt and I felt deceived. But that was the alcoholic talking. I also found out that this isn't a shocker. She is human. She is only someone who "offered" to guide me. I would have to do it on my own. She is only someone who gives me her wisdom, her experience. One alcoholic talking to another. I have learned that I need to put my sobriety first. My God, the program, then the people. But sponsorship is a suggestion. They are all suggestions. And ones that you can take or leave. I don't think any of it is the wrong or right way to go. I think that me as a person has to figure out my path. The gifts are there. God, the program, the people. I have them to use them however is right for me. That is the beauty of the Big Book. It is a gift. One to be thankful for and one to have and use my way. It's the same as choosing a God, as I understand Him. At least that is how I feel. My aunt once said, Have opinions, but don't be opinionated. I'm trying to apply that to the program. I am a person here trying to make my life better. And here, this gift of AA was given to me. So, what now? Well, I'm here, and I'm trying, and I'm doing. I hope everyone finds there path. Oh, and another thing. Someone in the program told me to look down in my own shoes. She also told me to tell other people that had ideas how I should live or practice the program to look in their own shoes. She told me that AA is a simple program. It works if you work it. And that has to be decided individually. And that person was my sponser.


Member: D-flat
Location: fargo
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 01:54 AM

Comments

Geeeess Why must we over analize everything,man,I needed help cause i was drinking to much and thought everyone else was the problem, then I met this guy who was sober and for the first time in my life,like someone said earlier,I could be honest and open about everything in my life and could see that he understood and didnt get bored and actually was hearing me, and we went through the steps one day a week, i did what he suggested and i have had a profound spiritual experiance, and thats what i needed, My mind needed to be renewed, and ever since then i havent had a desire to drink, and that will be 10yrs next month. keep it simple.


Member: mariab
Location: north florida
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 07:17 AM

Comments

As a newbie, many of you are serving as quasi-sponsors, which is really great. Thank you. I didn't drink last night. Yay. Starting again one day sober, Mariab


Member: L-RAY
Location: SCOTLAND
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 09:00 AM

Comments

Welcome Mariab" right on D-flat- iwas lost when i came here and like you thank god someone was there to show me the way! Regards L-RAY


Member: Joe P
Location: Chicago
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 09:58 AM

Comments

My name is Joe, and I am an alcoholic. I’ve never been asked by my sponsor, or by anybody else in AA, to worship or idolize them. What my sponsor did in the beginning was to take me through the Twelve Steps as his sponsor had done with him. Today, I continue to call my sponsor daily. I CHOOSE TO DO SO. The structure keeps me accountable to another human being for keeping up my part of this spiritual program. So, what I always recommend in finding a sponsor is to find a person who has gone through the 12 Steps with a sponsor. Sponsors are not financial counselors or bankers, marriage counselors, or anything else. Just another drunk who today is not drinking through God’s grace and the Twelve Steps. Personally, I do not believe I could have figured out the 12 Steps on my own, even with direction from the Big Book. Having a sponsor to direct me was essential. There is a reference to sponsorship developing in the early days of AA in Cleveland shortly after the publication of the Big Book. The reference can be found in “Alcoholics Anonymous Comes of Age”. In it, Bill W. credits the rapid growth of AA in part to the publication of the Big Book and to the experience with sponsorship in Cleveland. Of course, that is only the opinion of Bill W., but Bill W. also did much of the writing of the Big Book, also. Get a sponsor or don’t get a sponsor, your choice. But all the steps are worded in the plural, and the AA program is not meant to be taken alone.


Member: Cec H
Location: Stampede City
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 11:32 AM

Comments

Hi all Cec H alkie here. Carlc your wrong, everybody needs a sponcor in the begining . Even you did. And lets not get into semantics.


Member: NOT MEME
Location: NOT HERE
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 12:56 PM

Comments

it may not say the word sponser but it tell of how people have helped other people stay sober TRY READING IT AGAIN THIS TIME GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ASS


Member: NOT MEME
Location: NOT HERE
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 12:56 PM

Comments

it may not say the word sponser but it tell of how people have helped other people stay sober TRY READING IT AGAIN THIS TIME GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ASS


Member: Tom
Location: NY
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 02:48 PM

Comments

Day 31. Still sober and thankful for it. Haven't been to a meeting and don't have a sponsor. Someday maybe.. Best of luck to all


Member: Pam B to Jane
Location:
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 03:00 PM

Comments

(((Jane C))) – by your post, you are a fine example of what always happens when someone decides they know what they need before getting thru the 12 Steps w/a sponsor, so the 12 Steps can show you proper use of the will & how to think & make honest right decisions for yourself via reliance on God (your HP) – you got drunk. Your sponsor knew what she was talking about – if we don’t have sobriety we have nothing else - & getting into counseling before getting thru the 12 Steps first, mostly only causes confusion that prevents knowing how to live the 12 Steps one day at a time to stay sober. The BB does say if you need help for problems other than alcohol then go get that help (whether it be counseling or whatever) – but that is further in the book that suggestion is made - AFTER - we’re living the Steps. (ie – if then still having other problems, then go get help.) Counseling is not going to get/keep us sober. If we want Sobriety – our sobriety is our #1 firstmost priority above ALL else. Trust God to take of the other things till we are able to get to them.


Member: Pam B
Location: Daytona Beach, FL
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 03:06 PM

Comments

Hi – I’m Pam – an alcoholic, I know how frustrating the confusion was for me when new, when one set of AAers would say something is a “must” (ie “a suggestion” if you want to achieve sobriety) & then another set would say that’s wrong or give an exact opposite suggestion – which do you listen to?! – how could we possibly know who is right? This alone is one reason we need a sponsor from the very 1st day we come into AA & its suggested to get one ASAP if you didn’t get one at that 1st mtg. Be sure to ask if they have completed all 12 Steps from the BB (Big Book) since their last drink (or drug) with their own sponsor. If not, do not waste your time w/them even tho they may insist they can help you anyway - because no one can pass on what they haven’t got yet themselves - & as Carl C pointed out – too many filling these rooms refuse to follow the suggestions themselves so how could they possibly pass on sobriety to anyone else? What they pass on is the disease – not the solution. When new & before getting thru our own 12 Steps, we have no clue what this is all about because this is a Spiritual Program that we learn by our own experiences of following the suggestions to do our own footwork one day at a time – it cannot be learned nor understood by the intellect. There is nothing we can figure out about it or what we need or don’t need – doing that is what has always kept us drunk. Our own BEST Thinking is what got us here! & when it comes to knowing what we need for achieving sobriety & being able to keep it – we don’t know sh*t ! That is the reason we need a sponsor – a guide/a friend – someone who will help us learn the lingo, the slogans, go thru the reading of the BB with us to help us do our own 12 Steps so we in turn can pass it on to someone else. Your sobriety is your only concern so if you see that the one you asked to help you isn’t helping you w/these things – ask someone else. Pray for God (your HP) to show you who can help you. & if that one doesn’t work out – ask another - & so on – Willlingness to go any lengths – what you need for you. The BB is the outline to follow that if we follow the suggestions there then we will achieve permanent lasting sobriety. The 12&12 is an expose’ that further goes into detail of that outline in the BB – & the word SPONSOR most definitely in the 12&12. Read it so you will know for yourself. Bill W, Dr Bob – all of them had sponsors. Read the AA Conference Approved history books to know for yourself. Thanks for letting me share. Pam


Member: Johnson
Location: Colorado
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 03:35 PM

Comments

What a load of SHIT from Pam B.!!!! Newbies, that is ALL her personal opinion and NOT AA! Don't look at that silly post and take it as gospel, as you will later quite likely regret it. The big book NEVER mentions the word sponsor in the first 164 pages and it's something derived in the last few years by hospitals and treatment centers. Anyways, some of it is good and some not so good, listen, but do NOT make a rash decision and get somebody at the first meeting. That may be the most ludicrous thing I've ever heard of, as it takes time to know who's who and what's what in AA, just like anything else. Pam does NOT speak for what is and is not AA, so just take that stuff lightly's all I'm saying. Some people just like to think they know everything and she's obviously the exact type of sponsor one shouldn't get. Unfortunately that's exactly what is all pervasive in AA and thus the entire problem with sponsorship itself. The theory is fine, it's the practice as exemplified by Pam and most of the people in AA that's the problem.........


Member: Johnson
Location: Colorado
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 03:37 PM

Comments

What a load of SHIT from Pam B.!!!! Newbies, that is ALL her personal opinion and NOT AA! Don't look at that silly post and take it as gospel, as you will later quite likely regret it. The big book NEVER mentions the word sponsor in the first 164 pages and it's something derived in the last few years by hospitals and treatment centers. Anyways, some of it is good and some not so good, listen, but do NOT make a rash decision and get somebody at the first meeting. That may be the most ludicrous thing I've ever heard of, as it takes time to know who's who and what's what in AA, just like anything else. Pam does NOT speak for what is and is not AA, so just take that stuff lightly's all I'm saying. Some people just like to think they know everything and she's obviously the exact type of sponsor one shouldn't get. Unfortunately that's exactly what is all pervasive in AA and thus the entire problem with sponsorship itself. The theory is fine, it's the practice as exemplified by Pam and most of the people in AA that's the problem.........


Member: Avid
Location: Lurker
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 03:44 PM

Comments

Conference approved literature?? So freeegin what! That means nothing except that it was some other stupid person in AA's opinion as well. Nothing more, nothing less. It is NOT an end all and be all and it's assinine to suggest so!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Member: YouYouYou
Location: ThereThereThere
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 03:53 PM

Comments

Yes, 50-55 is only a few years. Geez, AA itself is only 65-68 years old, depending on who's telling the story. Either way, that's but a babies time in history and no tradittion at all as of yet. This is the mere beginnings of AA. IF it lasts that is!!!!!!!!!!!!


Member: Avid Lurker 2
Location:
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 04:09 PM

Comments

AA Conference Approved Literature is the beginning to branch out from what DOES work If AA doesn't last will be due to know-it-all egostists such as yourself bent on 'fixing' the clock that isn't broken in attempts to keep your own sickness well fed


Member: Timm
Location: Alabama
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 04:14 PM

Comments

DAY SIXTEEN. I have to agree with <<Becca California>>. To quote the “Big Book”: “Our book is meant to be suggestive only,” (first sentence, next to last paragraph, in the chapter “A Vision for You”). Last night I attended my fourth meeting in as many days; I’m finding meetings to be very beneficial, but I have not yet decided whether or not to seek out a sponsor. My inclination at this point is to not have a sponsor, but rather to develop healthy relationships with several different people within the program; however I feel it’s too early to make a definitive decision. Some of the preceding posts express strong opinions about sponsorship, both pro and con. Those who are pro-sponsorship, you are right, if it works for you. Those who are contra-sponsorship, you are right, if it works for you. Sponsorship is a suggestion, and the question of sponsorship has to be answered for each of us individually. …………. [“Let go of your attachment to being right, and suddenly your mind is more open. You're able to benefit from the unique viewpoints of others, without being crippled by your own judgment.” -- Ralph Marston]


Member: Glen
Location:
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 04:25 PM

Comments

Johnson, true, the word sponsor is never mentioned in the BB, but it isn't because it came from treatment centers. References to sponsors can be found in all the literature; the treatment center boom came along in the 70's and brought us the disease concept, among other things. One possible reason why the word sponsor isn't mentioned in the BB is because they all had them; typically, most of the first 100 worked the steps prior to leaving the hospital and were taken to their first meeting by their - and hence the name - sponsor. Bill refers to Ebby as his sponsor. Some good early history: http://silkworth.net/chs/


Member: Glen
Location:
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 04:25 PM

Comments

Johnson, true, the word sponsor is never mentioned in the BB, but it isn't because it came from treatment centers. References to sponsors can be found in all the literature; the treatment center boom came along in the 70's and brought us the disease concept, among other things. One possible reason why the word sponsor isn't mentioned in the BB is because they all had them; typically, most of the first 100 worked the steps prior to leaving the hospital and were taken to their first meeting by their - and hence the name - sponsor. Bill refers to Ebby as his sponsor. Some good early history: http://silkworth.net/chs/


Member: Pam B to Johnson - or Mike - or whatever your true name may be
Location:
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 04:46 PM

Comments

Johnson - what is it that you're so afraid will happen if others are free to follow the solution to their drink problem in the true way that God has given it to us thru the AA program? - What is it behind that obsession seeking to prevent that at every turn? . . . What is it that you are so AFRAID will happen if YOU get a sponsor yourself to help you overcome that reliance upon your own Twisted Alcoholic Thinking? >>>>>>>>>> Softcover 12&12 - pg 111 & top of pg 112 (which follows after several pgs of Step 12 which begins on pg 106 - clarifying what 12th Step work is - prime focus of these pages being that of a guide for how to sponsor others. I will quote this portion of this one paragraph here for those who care to persist with false statements rather than open the book itself - but this is not the ONLY place that has the word SPONSOR: . . . "Now comes the biggest question yet. What about the practice of these principles in all our affairs? Can we love the whole pattern of living as eagerly as we do the small segment of it we discover when WE TRY TO HELP OTHER ALCOHOLICS ACHIEVE SOBRIETY? Can we bring the same spirit of love and tolerance into our A.A. group? Can we have the same kind of confidence and faith in these people who have been infected and sometimes crippled by our own that we have in our own SPONSORS? . . . " - a word that has been "derived in the last few years by of hospitals and treatment centers" Johnson? - as you see here, that statement is very false - intended to misguide the newcomers - just as the rest of your post is. Its nothing more than the shining example of what someone who refuses to get a sponsor ASAP to help them is like.


Member: Susan A.
Location: Vernon, CT
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 05:16 PM

Comments

Hi all, I'm Susan and I'm an Alcoholic. About Sponsorship...I think that seeking a higher power's/God's will and trying to do it daily are strange concepts to a person new to sobriety who's trying to just not drink one day at a time. Change is necessary and scary at first. One of the first demonstrations of willingness to change is accepting suggestions/directions (which ever word you like) from one who has gone before you in this journey. Insisting on "doing it yourself" is just EGO getting in the way. When we stop fighting anyone or anything, new ideas can get in, and we can grow. A "guide/sponsor/friend/sober person/one-who's-got-something-you-want/whatever" can help answer questions, help focus you, see where you're sabotaging yourself, etc. and HELP you. If your experience with a person you call 'sponsor' is negative, MOVE ON and find another. If you take a drunken horse thief and sober 'em up, you still have a horse theif. In other words, people are fallible and we all have mondo-egos. If you are still holding onto a resentment about it, that's between you and God. I believe if the 'WE' is there because 'I' can't do this alone.


Member: Johnson
Location: For Everyone---Especially newer people
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 05:57 PM

Comments

Ebby Thatcher died DRUNK! That's a hell of note for someone considered AA's first sponsor, huh? He was also from the Oxford group and NOT AA! Bill's idea was as most of his, from the Oxford group and their idea of "spiritual advisor's/director's." Bill also never referred to Ebby as his "sponsor" until after the idea was promulgated by the "hospitals" of that era. Those facts are in direct correlation to what Glen mentions, however, the 12 & 12 ideas are NOT! While yes, the first 100ish did the steps in the "hospital" and went with their "sponsors" to their first meetings, the 12 & 12 wasn't even written until 12 years later for goodness sakes. Plus then it's only Bill W. and his personal opinion, NOT FACT!!!! The 12 & 12 holds NO historical weight as it is widely recognized as simply one man's way of making a living and his personal views. Very similar to, but not quite as good as "AA Comes of Age," since that's not quite as much into ego display and a little more objective and historically correct. Still history from Bill's perspective, but his perspective nonetheless. The point is the 12-12 is totally irrelevant to anyone getting sober and NOT needed, just as "sponsor" is NOT needed. Yes, it is obviously helpful to have a guide, but preferably NOT another AA member as this is exactly the kind of crap they come up with---their own--NOT historical facts!!! Find a priest, minister, friend, spouse, -----THAT's what the precious little big book says and I actually agree on that one. NOBODY to hold your hand and cry your self-pity parties and other nonsense. OR tell you where you are wrong or need to look at like Pam said, also stupid. Someone who will just walk beside you and help guide you to your own path, so that you can sing your own song---NOT Pam or whomever's. Carlc has it right on sponsorship--why do so few others in AA see it after long periods of time? Brainwashed? Seems pretty obvious to practically any outsider that answer is yes---objectively YES, brainwashed. I don't live that way despite the fact most in AA do. Yet see how much "tolerance" they give when you tell them something "out of syn" with their brainwashed ideologies? Is that attractive to anyone here? Does anyone want to treated like that? I would venture to say no and if you pick a sponsor immediately, you're obviously just going to be shooting blind. Go ahead kids, it's your lives, not mine. All I can do is tell you what I did, and I just did. I haven't had a "sponsor" for a long time and I haven't drank for a long time---there ya go---You do NOT "need" a "sponsor!!!"


Member: Avid Lurker 2
Location:
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 07:32 PM

Comments

lol! the twisted message deepens >>>>> now a NONalcoholic is the one who can help another alcoholic to achieve sobriety before another sober alcoholic could ??? !!! lmao! >>>>> so dry you're close to going up in flames from crossing your legs - far from sobriety!


Member: Suzyqnj
Location: NJ
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 08:02 PM

Comments

I've had a hard time getting and useing a sponser ever since I got sober four years ago. I was driven to get a sponser because I needed help with my fourth step. A friend told me to read the pamphlet on sponsership. At first I told him it didn't help because all it said was that a sponser is to guide you through the steps. He said that's all it says because that's what it means. So I got a sponser to help me work the steps. Even CarlC said another alcoholic helped him through the steps. The rest of it.....is the 'fellowship'. Some people have had lots of help from others in the fellowship, some have not. The only question is...What am I willing to do? SuzyQ


Member: MARK M
Location: COLUMBIA TN
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 08:46 PM

Comments

hey to all markm here alcoholic today is day 62 c/s, and yes i do have a sponsor he is the meanist SOB i've ever met but if i need to talk to someone about a step i'm working on or have a Q he knows what to tell me without him i would have went back out 30 days a go this is just my opinion GET A SPONSOR


Member: SHAWN M.
Location: MASS
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 09:37 PM

Comments

hey folks, my name is shawn and i am unfortunatly an alchoholic.i do not yet have a sponser or any comments on sponsership.but i do feel the need to let yall know that i have recently been released from the C.A.C. where i was doing time for my third D.W.I.while i was in jail i did not just dry up,i got sober.during that time i was able to attend four civilian A/A meetings a week.i am now at home with a gadget on my ankle to keep me on the property.anyway,i have not been to any meetings.i'm kinda freaking out.i have never had to deal with my family sober before.could somebody please say something to help ease my sick little mind. thanx shawn


Member: Tom
Location: NY
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 11:04 PM

Comments

Shawn, good luck. Think of it this way.. They haven't had the opportunity to deal with you sober probably in a long time. I'll bet they're looking forward to it. Best of Luck


Member: Bill J
Location: Kingsville TX
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 11:06 PM

Comments

For Johnson: Your facts are not correct. Note below: Just a point of information. Ebby Thacher had 2 years and seven months of continuous sobriety at first. He continued to relapse starting in 1937, approximately 7 years of continuous sobriety while in Texas in the 1950's and about 2 and a half years of sobriety prior to his death in the Spring of 1966. There were shorter periods of abstinence during the period between when he first stopped drinking through the Oxford Group and when he passed away in upstate NY. Mitchell K.


Member: Bill J 12-19-75
Location: Kingsville TX
Date: July 14, 2003
Time: 11:22 PM

Comments

On reading your whole spiel Johnson I think You are very opinated and full of shit on top of it. some people elivat a sponsor to a place they don't belong. but that is human error. Over all sponsorship is real good. If you don't want one ok but let it stand at that. don't say all sponsorship is bad. In my 27 years of soberity I have had two (They died sober) and now have a third. I also have a spiritual advisor. I have found that my God works through people. drunks that Isolate usually die drunk so get a people to help you. Call them what you want just use them as a sounding board and remember they are human (Fallable)Love to my cyber friends.bj


Member: drunk y
Location:
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 12:50 AM

Comments

Well, I was going to get sober tonight, finally, but I read all the postings here and changed my mind. Who wants to be sober.... and end up like all of YOU????


Member: Johnson
Location: Denver
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 01:13 AM

Comments

BJ---No my friend your information is incorrect. It is a well documented fact that Ebby died drunk and he is buried in Albany, New York. His entire life story( in short of course) is there and I seriously doubt they are going to belittle the man at his very gravesite just to degrade some AAer's like you who refuse to believe truth and historical fact. You can believe what you want, you're just not correct in your statements just because you got them out of some book. Me, I'll go along with what's on his grave.


Member: Johnson
Location: Denver
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 01:15 AM

Comments

BJ---No my friend your information is incorrect. It is a well documented fact that Ebby died drunk and he is buried in Albany, New York. His entire life story( in short of course) is there and I seriously doubt they are going to belittle the man at his very gravesite just to degrade some AAer's like you who refuse to believe truth and historical fact. You can believe what you want, you're just not correct in your statements just because you got them out of some book. Me, I'll go along with what's on his grave. I just love how AAer's attempt to revise history to suit their own needs and views and then say you're "intolerant" and "judgemental" when you don't agree with their revisionist history. Funny, but sad......


Member:
Location:
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 01:19 AM

Comments

Member: Carlc Location: nm Date: 15 Jul 2003 Time: 00:10:25 Comments Les from san diego, the topic is the 8th step and not all the different dictionarys there are or meanings of words.I did an 8th step and and a ninth and contuinue to do 10, 11, and 12 according to my willingness. Like I said before I crawl before no man, I have friends that I can call if I need to talk to someone and I have a spiritual adviser. As for a sponsor sorry I am not a kiss ass, and it makes me sad to see grown men having to have another man validate their existence.


Member: Kerry C
Location: TX (KerryCtx@hotmail.com)
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 01:59 AM

Comments

Shawn it must be a system shock to go from 4 meetings weekly to zero. I was at a Big Book study tonight and we were reading from The Family Afterward chapter. I hadn't read that chapter in awhile and was surprised at some of the good stuff in there. It might be particularly useful for you to read that chapter to be reminded of the results of alcoholism to the people around us. If you want you can email me and we can talk recovery. Not so much as sponsor or anything just 2 drunks talking about the solution.


Member: Jane C.
Location: Alaska
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 02:09 AM

Comments

Jane C. to Pam B....I guess I didn't mention that I was almost 2 years sobera before I looked into counseling....It helped at the the time...but we were also told that there would be setbacks and that we would need to start over again... whenever we were in a stressful situation.. and there have been many over the years...I didn't drink..but I was in a state of mind that wasn't normal to my way of thinking... I did the things I was taught in therpy...but it wasn't an easy thing to deal with...I had 18 years of sobriety...no slips...but this time I'm not having an easy time...I don't even WANT to drink...but Iknow that when I get TIRED more than anything else...I think about taking the drink...to relax and sleep and do whatever it is to get over the feeling of complete exhaustion... HALT....Huangry, Angry Lonely and Tired...these are the things they warn us about...tired and hungry are the two that I struggle with...I'm always hungry but I don't give in to it...but the TIRED is the killer for me...and it hurts me every time I give in to the drink...I did it today..I had 3 glasses of wine..at home and I feel like a total failure...I don't feel guilt because I only hurt myself the guilt comes when it hurts someone else...I only hope that I can listen to what God is telling me that he wants for my life...and maybe tomorrow I won't take that drink...but I know that alcoholics drink....and I also know that If I could get to real meetings I don't think I would slip...I never did the first time around and I did many meetings...even If it was only 2 or 3 a week for me that was a lot and it did keep me sober...I hope we all have a sober day tomorrow and that there will be many folks with a lot of years of sobriety to hear from...May GOd Bless you all...have a sober day..


Member: Becca
Location: California
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 02:12 AM

Comments

Hello there everyone. 105 days today! Congrats to Mark! Well done. Congrats to Tom on 31 days! (applause and cheers here!) Thank you Tim for your words. Great share to you too. Drunk Y - if you are still reading, hang in there. It's worth it. I know it gets intense but there are so many different paths here in the program. So many voices. So many wonderful twists and turns. I hope you stay. Well, I hope everyone is starting the week off well. Here is a big smile from one alcoholic to another. :)


Member: Becca
Location: California
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 02:32 AM

Comments

Hey Shawn, I wanted to say hi to you. Wow, I'm sorry you are having a rough time. Get your hands on a big book and start reading. Pray on your knees to a God, spirit, force, of your understanding. Trust that all is happening as it should be. Hang in there. It may be a bumpy ride, but worth every bump. I know this sounds corny and I hope not too preachy. Just passing along gifts I've gotten. I figure it's better to try it. You know? Prayers to you.


Member: mariab
Location: north florida
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 07:21 AM

Comments

Mariab here: Day 2, good morning!


Member: Tom
Location: NY
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 07:58 AM

Comments

Mariahb, I remember day 2 for some reason more than the others. It was soo much better than day 1 ! Alot easier, but not exactly easy. Day 3 & 4 too. Day 5 was rough for some reason. I just walked out the door and kept going so I wouldn't grab a beer. By the time I got home, I was partially tired but mostly proud that I did something and didn't drink. Ya know those days where you would like to kick yourself in the ass for having a drink when just the day before you swore "tomorrow I'm gonna do it"? Well, it's the opposite, it was very self satisfying knowing "I did it" So have a great day 2 and do what it takes to give day 3 a GOOD MORNING Like that. Best of Luck


Member: mariab
Location: north florida
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 08:55 AM

Comments

((Tom NY)) Thanks! I pray for strength.


Member: Jackie
Location: MN
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 09:44 AM

Comments

Question for you Bill. How do you go about getting a Spiritual Advisor, and what do they do for you? If you don't mind me asking that is.


Member: Brad L.
Location: Sarasota, FL 34231
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 09:52 AM

Comments

Great topic: What would I have done without a sponsor? When I first stopped drinking in Northern California, I was living in a railroad boxcar on an unused siding! 5 nights before my last drink, I sat on this RR on a milk carton waiting for the manifest from Weaverville to Sacramento at 3:00am to come along and end my misery. When that didn't happen - Instead, I was sitting on the loading track and a RR car was behind me, and as I had on my headphone with my BOOM-BOX turned to the INTH degree, it was nudging me down the track! I turned and saw a man hanging on the side of the boxcar, and I asked him if this was the track for the manifest train? He asked me Why? I told him that life was so unfair that I couldn't face it anymore and wanted to end it all! He told me to wait there and he would find out for me! I, like a dummy, sat and waited and a few minutes later, half the town's finest was there with their lights flashing and that was the last time I went to their GREY-BAR-HOTEL on the hill! They escorted me to Jail on the 2nd day of January, 1991 and the Judge was coming down the stairs as they were leading me up, and he told me to go and walk it off, because there wasn't room for the likes of a drunk like me there. I went walking and wound up at 10:00 that morning outside the auditorium of the REd Lion Inn where there were a bunch of drunks going inside. I knew that if there were that many drunks going into one place at a time, that there had to be something inside to drink. So, like the drunk that I was, I followed them in. I sat and listened to a man tell my life story for the next hour and afterwards I had a drink with him - what I had gone in for in the first place for - of all things 'ROOT-BEER'!!!!! I got what I needed; not what I wanted! Of all things, I asked this man to be my sponsor... Until I left California in 1997 he was still, and to this day whenever there is a major problem, I still call him or communicate with him by E-Mail. A sponsor saved my life; and if you think that you can live the life of a sober alcoholic without one; I suggest that you stand on your head when you read step 1 and make the first word of the step 'ME' instead of 'WE'! I sponsor several men - Not for what I can do for them, but what they can do for me; keep me sober on a daily basis. If they stay sober, all is well and good; but my main reason for sponsoring other men is to stay sober myself. My sponsor told me this many years ago, and it has worked this past 12 years and when it stops working, which it will when I die, I'll move on to the next step!!!


Member: Ethan T
Location: MA
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 09:55 AM

Comments

mariab - congrats & good luck today. I'm also on Day 2. I've been here many times before, but always get cocky and justify just a "few" beers today (i.e. "tomorrow I'm gonna do it"). Kind of my own version of one day at a time. I'm intent on it sticking this time. My biggest challenge is the booze and other drinker in the house. Hope you have terrific sober day.


Member: Susan A.
Location: Vernon, CT
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 10:42 AM

Comments

Hi all, I'm Susan and I'm an Alcoholic. CarlC, you usually have good gems deeply hiddend in those layers of coal. I would really like to know what happened to make you think reaching out and making a relationship with a sponsor is equivalent to "kissing ass" and "asking for validation" (your words - "As for a sponsor sorry I am not a kiss ass, and it makes me sad to see grown men having to have another man validate their existence"). Last night, a sober friend of mine just found out her 17 y/o daughter's 1 wk old child is diagnosed with a serious genetic malady. When she could, she drove straight to the "meeting after the meeting" after our 7:30 step meeting because she knew DOES have a connection with God, and that allows her to know God works through people and that she needed the support of her sponsor and friends in A.A. She was hurting and needed -support and help-. She wasn't kissing anyone's ass. She was using people who'd gone before to ease her way and give her ideas of how to stay sane, sober, and be of help to herself and family. I don't understand your antagonism, though I would like to.


Member: Angela
Location: NY
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 11:43 AM

Comments

You know what is sad, all the bickering on here all because we have different opinions. It's sad because, in my opinion, what helps us all stay sober, universaly, is knowing we are not alone. Sponsers can vary, depending on who has found a good match for their personality. I had a sponser that I didn't care for. She really didn't seem to show that much interest and if I saw her at a meeting she barely said hello to me. That was not what I needed. I needed someone to encourage me, show me the ropes, etc. She was sick one day and didn't want to talk, I told her to let me know when she felt better so I would not bother her and she never called me. So it all depends on what experience we've had. I've met great people online that I have kept in contact with via email and that have helped me tremdously in staying sober. We need to stick together and not argue so much because only another alkie understands the struggle. Let's keep it simple and one day at a time.


Member: Karen P.
Location: Wrightsville & Atlanta, GA
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 12:28 PM

Comments

I have one year and four months of sobriety. I have a sponsor who has been an excellent source of support and guidance for me. This has been an interesting experience, since I could easily be her mother, given our age difference. But she has more experience with sobriety, and has had the generosity to share that experience with me. It has been a great help. If I can do the same for someone else, it will be an honor to give back what has been given so freely to me.


Member: Any alcholic
Location: usa
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 02:01 PM

Comments

Please let us all realize we have a very serious problem and it's so hard to overcome -let's stop the nasty b.s. arguements over the program. That's what gives AA a bad name. Why not let it be open.....take what you need and leave the rest. Damn this is supposed to be an early sobriety website...let's stop preaching and just be there for each other! I am only one day in....please just say you understand. all the bickering makes an early sobriety person want to pick up pronto...just be there to listen and just understand the stuggle. Sponsorship should be an opiton, when ready. Damn, I'm going one minute here...please help....


Member: Johnson
Location: Colorado
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 02:21 PM

Comments

Agreed my friend, welcome. I do hope and pray you stay and get to real meetings to be able to decide for yourself. That is what it's about, realizing we do have and are able to make choices when at first we may not think or feel we have any choice but to drink. I not only wish you well, but am ashamed of myself for participating, or at least in the manner which I did so. I apologize also to Pam as she had 'some' good points as well. Take care my new brother/sister in AA and do your best to get to a real meeting so you can decide for yourself. Thanks for settin us "older ones" straight, or at least back on track. See, we all need each other as you are actually helping us at this point.


Member: Ethan T
Location: MA
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 02:53 PM

Comments

"Any alcoholic" - I'm with you. I don't know if AA has anything that can help me, but I'm looking for hope. The bickering and pontificating seem to suggest lots 'my way or the highway' type thinking, which is a huge turn-off to me. On the other hand, the genuine humility and helping hands extended by other participants IS encouraging to me.


Member: Any alcholic
Location: USA
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 03:42 PM

Comments

Ethan, I am with you and Johnson, I so appreciate your comments, little remarks like yours spur me on to another sober day. We are so fragile in the beginning and all this matters.. Anyone who shows me understanding, when I feel so all alone, really matters. Know that you really help. Any words of encourgement and understanding help.. I've been having a really hard day and I need all the help I can get. I have been to meetings b/f, have a hard time getting there, slipped up bad and am trying again. Since I have a hard time getting to F2F, sometimes this is all I have. Good luck and support to all....


Member: Ethan T
Location: MA
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 04:07 PM

Comments

Any alcholic - Thanks. I'm pretty new to this idea of sharing my struggle with alcohol with others. It does seem like it may be helpful, although I've got to say that it's utterly amazing to me that my words may be of some help to you or anyone else in their struggle to stay sober, when those words of mine are coming from the same brain that repeatedly convinces me that I SHOULD drink. Go figure. Well, coming up on my personal witching hour - if I can get to about 8 pm tonight without cracking one, I'll be home free for Day 2. Best wishes to everyone for success today.


Member: Kerry C
Location: TX (KerryCtx@hotmail.com)
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 05:33 PM

Comments

Ethan and anyone else struggling with very early sobriety. I found in my first 2 weeks that lots of candy/sugar helped a lot. Alcohol is converted by the body into sugar. We take alcohol out and still crave the sugar. Also I had to keep myself very busy the first 2 weeks. The less time I had to sit around thinking about drinking the better off I was. Anyone feel free to email me if you want to talk about solving your drinking problem.


Member:
Location:
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 05:53 PM

Comments

Hey Ethan...just knowing you are Struggling like I am..helps me...should u want to corresond and we could help each other..I am open to that....please email me at BLincks@aol.com...I need to know I AM NOT ALONE maybe we could help each other....Angie....


Member:
Location:
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 06:00 PM

Comments

Ethan, I am thinking of you and I hope maybe you have found the the strength not to pick up tonight. If not,know that I am right behind you in this battle and hope we can help each other in this battle. Please get in touch w/me so we can help each other. Angela aka BLincks@aol.com


Member: SHAWN M.
Location: MASS
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 09:23 PM

Comments

hey folks, my name is shawn and i am still an alchoholic.i would like to thank the people who responded to last nights distress call.you know who you are.i made it thru the night and it looks like i'm gonna make it today as well.i have been sober for 5 1/2 months but it bothers me that i sometimes still want to drink even after all it has cost me.thats why i need a sponser.i should be cleared to attend A/A meetings on a daily basis by tommorow.thanx again. shawn


Member: hello
Location: wake up call
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 09:44 PM

Comments

I can go weeks without drinking . than I began to feel great I feel so good that I feel like drinking again. So I drink the next day I'm sick and I don't feel that great.So its back to not drinking ontill the next time I feel great. I no go to the meeting but than I start feel good and I'm OFF AGAIN just a thought


Member: Bill J 12-19-75
Location: Kingsville TX
Date: July 15, 2003
Time: 11:01 PM

Comments

Member: Jackie Location: MN Comments Question for you Bill. How do you go about getting a Spiritual Advisor, and what do they do for you? If you don't mind me asking that is. My spiritual advisor is somebody that is real knolegable in spiritual thing (A Babptist Preacher and Christian Counsler) I can't remember if I ask him or told him he was my spiritual advisor. He has been helpful in answering som spiritual issues for me like when it was left up to me by to rest fo the family to make the dicesion of wheather to take my Mother off the ventulator after a week and die in peace.I also ask him some things that would be Christian not AA in nature so I'll not share them here. If you are intrested I'm at. wjones24@swbell.net


Member: AZbill
Location: Sierra Vista, Arizona
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 01:00 AM

Comments

HI. Bill here. Alcoholic from Arizona. In AA, sponsor and sponsored meet as equals, just as Bill and Dr. Bob did. Essentially, the process of sponsorship is this: An alcoholic who has made some progress in the recovery program shares that experience on a continuous, individual basis with another alcoholic who is attempting to attain or maintain sobriety through AA. None of my sponsors required me to share any personal information. (Fourth or Fifth Steps). That was up to me. I generally do not share personal information with an unqualified alcoholic. I do not lay fourth and fifth step information on the tables at AA meetings. My Medical problems go to a doctor. Any mental problems go to a shrink. A few of the many things AA (as such) does not do is practice medicine, psychiatry, or nursing. We do not offer religious services, We not offer professional counseling. It is against to law to do these things without license. By the way my first "sponsor" was sober 1 day and I 7 days. We are both still sober today :) Take care. az-bill@mindspring.com


Member: Carlc
Location: nm
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 01:35 AM

Comments

To Susan I will try to be brief because it is a long story. When I was new to this about 25 years ago and thru the years the years I have had bad experiences with sponsors and it is probably not right to paint them all with the same brush but here goes. I had two people that I trusted use what I had told them in confidence against me. One tried to hit on my girlfriend with me in the room of AA. Another close friend of mine who sponsored many people sold marijuana in AA. some of the biggest proponenents of sponsorship that I knew ran a cocaine ring out of various AA clubs. I know a bunch who are predators, and prey on young women and men. I know of countless instances where these poor people were decieved, went out and drank and have never been back to AA. I have seen them steal money from clubs, have sex with their sponcees and then discard them. I could go on and on but you get the message. As for the person who thinks we should get along you have to remember you are dealing with people who are insane. The job of a spiritual adviser is just that to advise in spiritual matters, a friend or guide in AA is someone who will guide you thru the steps the way they are outlined in the book. There are many people who really want this thing and get tangled up with the wrong people. A good friend of mine who was not the sharpest knife in the drawer got dropped by his sponsor for no good reason, he just did not want to be bothered, was hurt because he was too dependant on this person instead of his higher power went out got drunk and Died. I have friends in and out of AA that I can call and also have a spiritual adviser. I think the problem is that there are very few people that take this for what it is, a matter of life and death.


Member: William S
Location: SE USA
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 02:06 AM

Comments

First timer. True the word sponsorship does not appear in the book. With all these "precise" shares and esoteric crap; not one person has mentioned that Bill Wilson took all 12 steps in Chapter one with Ebby T. If that is not sponorship what is? I learned that from someone who has posted in here and he has neglected to mention that.


Member: Jane C.
Location: Alaska
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 02:51 AM

Comments

Hi,Jane C.an alcoholic still..so many good things have been posted, it's hard to know what to address.. but first good luck to all the new folks with 2nd.days 31 day and all the other members who are struggling with alcohol...it's ten fifteen PM my safe time...I had nothing to drink today...a good day for me,,, I feel like member"wake up call" I feel good for a few days and think it's OK to take drink...thinking it will be just fine...the way I feel about myself afterward is not good...I drink alone at home so I think while I do it it's OK..not so...I'm really not succeeding in staying away from a drink this time..I worry about what it may be doing to me physically..emotionally it makes me feel so very ashamed.. I agree with so many who have posted on the bickering that goes on in AA When I got sober the first time..in Texas...it was called "Cross Talk" and it wasn't tolerated much...but there still was a lot of telling what to do instead of just sharing what worked for the individual...so now and then things would get a bit out of control.... Shawn,you will make it...keep good thoughts...I hope to be where you are one day again....my husband was\ still alive my first time around and he sometimes didn't make it too easy for me..I learnded that sometimes they don't want the alcoholic to stay sober...they lose contol over them when they start to get strong I didn't drink over anything..I really needed to stay sober and I would tell myself things like.... "I'll do it no matter what it takes, even if it's just to show everyone".I know it was wrong thinking, but it worked for me... I think I've said enough, but there are so many good things here from all of you that I can't remember it all, so I go back to read as much as I can everyday....God Bless you All


Member: Sheri R.
Location: Vernon, CT
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 02:51 AM

Comments

((Susan A.)) I notice you are from Vernon, CT. I also live in Vernon. I have been reading and posting in the Coffee Pot, but this is the first time I have come into this Early Sobriety Meeting post. I am having troubles finding meetings around here and wondered if you could help me. Could you please send me a e-mail? I desperately need some help right now. My e-mail address is: srussell_76@hotmail.com I hope to hear from you soon. Thank you so much and God Bless!


Member:
Location:
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 08:51 AM

Comments

mariab: Day 3. Thank god


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 09:23 AM

Comments

Hi All, Kelly an alcoholic. I met with my sponsor last night to sit on a bench outside of the meeting and go through the Big Book together. She passes down what was passed down from her sponsor and I highlight it in my Big Book so when I sponsor I can pass on that knowledge. I did not find the right sponsor until 7 months but it was not for lack of trying. I fired one because in my newness I did not ask her if she had been through the Steps or if she herself had a sponsor which she did not. A couple others were not available enough so I let them go. I wanted a sponsor that had what I wanted and it took time to find a good fit. I'm happy with my sponsor and she is taking me through the Steps as laid out in the Big Book. Someone asked what a spiritual advisor is and I have a couple. They are just people in AA that guide me to make the right decisions and that I can bounce things off of. I call them and talk. My sponsor I use for help with the Steps not so much personal stuff. I think we should just do what feels right for us and give ourselves a little credit. Many alcoholics are of above average intelligence and can decide what is right for ourselves. I don't understand the arguing here or what it is supposed to accomplish? No one should get a sponsor because some sponsors are bad people? Give us a little credit to figure that out on our own. How is a person supposed to go through Steps 4 and 5 without a sponsor? Yes, it could be done but not anywhere near as well as with the guidence of someone who has been through it themselves and it changed their life. Are we going to rewrite the AA program? What will we call it? AA... Alcoholics Alone Program? Sponsorship IS a big part of AA and I don't see that changing anytime soon so instead of swimming against the current I choose to go with the flow. I use my sober mind and God's help to choose the right person to guide me through the Steps and hopefully one day I can take another drunk through them. If you have had a bad experience with a sponsor don't throw the baby out with the bath water, just find a better one next time. If you cop a resentment over this it could make you drink again because resentments are the number one killer of alcoholics, not sponsors. I'll end with something my sponsor told me. "Say what you mean, mean what you say but don't say it meanly". Peace. Kelly


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 09:28 AM

Comments

Hi All, Kelly an alcoholic. I met with my sponsor last night to sit on a bench outside of the meeting and go through the Big Book together. She passes down what was passed down from her sponsor and I highlight it in my Big Book so when I sponsor I can pass on that knowledge. I did not find the right sponsor until 7 months but it was not for lack of trying. I fired one because in my newness I did not ask her if she had been through the Steps or if she herself had a sponsor which she did not. A couple others were not available enough so I let them go. I wanted a sponsor that had what I wanted and it took time to find a good fit. I'm happy with my sponsor and she is taking me through the Steps as laid out in the Big Book. Someone asked what a spiritual advisor is and I have a couple. They are just people in AA that guide me to make the right decisions and that I can bounce things off of. I call them and talk. My sponsor I use for help with the Steps, not so much the personal stuff. I think we should just do what feels right for us and give ourselves a little credit. Many alcoholics are of above average intelligence and can decide what is right for ourselves. I don't understand the arguing here or what it is supposed to accomplish? No one should get a sponsor because some sponsors are bad people? Give us a little credit to figure that out on our own. How is a person supposed to go through Steps 4 and 5 without a sponsor? Yes, it can be done but not anywhere near as well as with the guidance of someone who has been through it themselves and it changed their life. Are we going to rewrite the AA program? What will we call it? AA... Alcoholics Alone Program? Sponsorship (IS) a big part of AA and I don't see that changing anytime soon so instead of swimming against the current I choose to go with the flow. I use my sober mind and God's help to choose the right person to guide me through the Steps and hopefully one day I can take another drunk through them. If you have had a bad experience with a sponsor don't throw the baby out with the bath water, just find a better one next time. If you cop a resentment over this it could make you drink again because resentments are the number one killer of alcoholics, not sponsors. I'll end with something my sponsor told me once. "Say what you mean, mean what you say but don't say it meanly". Peace. Kelly


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 10:25 AM

Comments

Sorry to post twice... Need more coffee... ;)


Member: Ethan T
Location: Mass
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 10:51 AM

Comments

Day #3. Made it through Day 2 by wearing myself out with a long bike ride at the end of the day, then after the kids fell asleep, got lost in Stephen Ambrose historical essays. (For me, reading about how people in the past took on huge tasks, struggled, persevered and finally succeeded is a great distraction from my own problems, and is also inspirational in my struggles.) Anyway, I'm going against the flow a bit. Haven't gone to a meeting, don't have a sponsor. But for now, I'm finding ample support from the RBB (Really Big Book - the Bible) and through the folks here. Thanks to AZbill and others for sharing their experience about how sponsors worked for them. That helps me understand how someone could assist me in the recovery process, when/if I choose to seek additional assistance. Thanks for being there.


Member: Craig L (Dogmanor@yahoo.com)
Location: Aloha, Oregon
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 11:00 AM

Comments

Sponsorship seemed very alien to me when I first got to AA. It sounded like AA was some kind of closed organization. I was mentally very sick and I thought I could do everything on my own. I had never been honest with anyone and really didn’t know how. Getting close to anyone scared the hell out of me. Alcohol pounded every scrap of resistance out of me, so that AA was the “last house on the block”. I came back one more time with willingness. I started by asking a guy to sponsor me and decided I would at least not lie to him; a tall order for this pathological liar. Today I am close to Chyle and I Love him as I try to Love everyone in recovery. He is no paragon, just another drunk, who has something I want. Today, he is my “closed mouth friend” I can check in with, when I’m feeling brilliant. The truth for me is many people have served as teachers of how and how not to practice AA


Member: Susan A.
Location: Vernon, CT
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 11:20 AM

Comments

Hi All, I'm Susan and I'm an Alcoholic. To CarlC, the things you spoke of are horrendous and very painful. Thank you for your willingness to allow me to understand you better. To Sheri R., I think this is the first time I've been to this meeting, too, as I usually attend the Discussion meeting. Coincidences...God's way of remaining anonymous 8^). Thanks for reaching out, that willingness to take action (and not drinking) keeps us sober. I'll email. There's lots of good meetings in the area, ex: tonight (Wed) there's a nice speaker meeting at 8 p.m. at Sacred Heart on Rt 30 (around back of the 1 story bldg), and a Big Book mtg same place, same time Thurs. Fri, I go to the 7 p.m. Tolland meeting (1st Congregational church). It'd be great to meet you there.


Member: Susan A.
Location: Vernon, CT
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 11:41 AM

Comments

I meant to add a link to the CT AA web site before hitting the enter key. http://www.ct-aa.org/index.html


Member: Jane C.
Location: Alaska
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 11:42 AM

Comments

Jane C..an alcoholic...the start of day 2..you can do it Mariab..I hope to get through the day too...I have calls to make and places to get to..no time for picking up a drink.. I'll be back tonight to read all the good news that will be posted...


Member: Johnson
Location: Colorado
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 02:01 PM

Comments

Thanks Carlc, old pal. Good share, it does help to understand you and I concur as I have seen and experienced many of the same things in AA. You're a way cool cat man!!!!!!


Member: Lynn
Location: Maine
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 05:34 PM

Comments

One year ago tonight, I had my last drink (several, in fact). My experience regarding sponsorship is mostly positive. When I first started going to AA meetings, particularly "beginners" meetings, I felt a lot of pressure to get a sponsor right away, but I didn't feel like I had found the right person. Especially since most of the people who indicated that they were available to serve as sponsors were male. I considered one person, then another, but something made me hesitate. Finally, last October, I realized that I had found someone whose personality was compatible, who wasn't going to order me around, but who knew this program and was willing to share that knowledge. I asked, she said yes, and assured me that if it didn't work I could tell her it wasn't working, and there would be no hard feelings. It is working. We are working on the 12 steps as outlined in the Big Book. When I almost grabbed a drink a couple of months ago, she helped me deal with the causes. I trust her. She's not my only trusted AA friend, but she's an important ally in my recovery. That's my experience, and I hope it helps someone out there!


Member: Rich
Location: NE
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 05:53 PM

Comments

Finding the right sponsor is like finding the right spouse. For some,it's love at first sight for others it needs more nurturing.


Member: Pam B - Sobergirl91 at hotmail.com
Location: Daytona Beach, FL
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 07:11 PM

Comments

(((Everyone))) - sorry for coming on strong - my apologies to those I've upset. (((Jane))) - sorry I had jumped the gun without all the info. Please email me anytime - sounds like we may have some things in common - I had also gone for additional outside help for chronic anxiety disorder long after I had been living the 12 for a time. (((Sheri))) I'm excited for you mtg (((Susan))) here (one of them God Things :) (((Lynn))) - HAPPY * * * 1st Anniversary * * * - thank you all for being here. Pam


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: July 16, 2003
Time: 10:56 PM

Comments

hi Diane here day 113 sober, Sponsor don't have one, God is my Sponsor, best of luck to all and stay sober


Member: Stacy
Location: West Coast
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 12:21 AM

Comments

Hi. Stacy, 100 days today. Wow, 3 digits. I have a sponsor. She's a tremendous source of insight and encouragement. I only wish I could spend more time with her than we are able. She is a great "center" for me when my head is flying all over the place. I have found that being a part of AA requires action. I am the sort of person who needs to be accountable to another or I tend to resist change and action especially. My sponsor keeps me in check. Take care, everyone.


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 12:30 AM

Comments

Hi (((Diane))), Great on the 113 days!!! Hope everything is going good with your computer work and family. I finally made up my mind to cut bait with the man I was dating on Tuesday. It was not even hard because God just laid the answer at my feet. I had a kind of epiphany on Sunday and by Monday I had made up my mind. I also went to a Big Book meeting Monday night and we read Steps 6 and 7. It was just what I needed to hear. I acknowledged my character defect of being velcro for abusive men, but at least seeing the red flags now. On Step 7, the action part was I willing to ask God to remove that defect? and that was a big fat YES. Tuesday was D-Day and he took it well when I explained that we are on different spiritual paths and I need to go my own way. I told him how I felt disrespected by some of the things he said and did and I can't settle for less than what I truely deserve. He tried to say he would change but I told him that it takes a lot of time and work to correct our character defects and we can't change our core being overnight. After he left I felt like a big rock was lifted off me. This was not even hard to do with Gods help. I am constantly amazed at how AA helps me in ALL aspects of my life. Pretty amazing how it works. Tomorrow night I pick up my 10 month chip in front of my friends and my sponsor. All by just taking it one day at a time! Congrats on passing the 3 month mark Diane. Take Care. Kelly


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 12:33 AM

Comments

(((Stacy))) Congrats on 100 days! You go girl. It works if you work it. Kelly


Member: Becca
Location: California
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 01:28 AM

Comments

Hello Becca, alcoholic. Lots of good shares to read. "Any alcoholic" - hang in there. Johnson -nice share. Nice way to step up to the plate and be honest and pure. Shawn - you are doing a great job! Hang in there. Just be careful of highs as well as lows. I had to focus on that a lot in the first 90 days. I would feel so good and on top of the world and then just drop. So, now I just like it when I feel like I'm just floatin' along with the waves, soft or hard. Mariab - Way to go! Jane - Congrats on Day 2! Lynn - Congrats on one year. And also congrats to Diane and Stacy! (my applause to all of you) It's so hard to stay focused and stay true to the program. The alcoholic so wants to be "right" all the time, and wants to proove everyone wrong. I have to constantly remind myself that I'm here to unlearn bad habits. I'm here to start fresh. I was actually practicing hearing the words that "I know nothing". I'm like a baby, learning to take steps in this new world. I'm so stubborn to "let go" and that is what I learned in the beginning. I have to let go of my old ideas. We all have our path and we all have to be honest. Well, to see myself honestly as stubborn and minipulative, you know, was hard. Me? No. Couldn't be? I'm the victim. Hmmm.....well I'm trying to retire those beliefs and take a stand to be honest and true. Wow, watching "my onion" peel is somethin' to see and feel. Hang in there everyone. Keep up the good work! Thank you for your shares. And thank you for listening to mine.


Member: Aprill G
Location: Wyoming
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 01:56 AM

Comments

Hi, I went to my first AA meeting today and just didn't feel like this was the right place for me, but did feel like the 12 steps could be very useful and beneficial for me. I am trying to find some support and help upon the advice of my counselor, but I just didn't think this meeting was the best place for me. Does anyone have any ideas or thought, suggestions as to what I should do? Thanks. Sorry if I'm not doing this right, I'm brand new and don't know all the rules.


Member: Jane C.
Location: Alaska
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 02:20 AM

Comments

Hi Jane C..an alcoholic...I said I would be back tonight to hear all the good news hear all the good news and there was sure a lot of it !!! How good to hear about all the good people getting chips and celebrating what some call BIRTHDAYS and other groups called ANNIVERSARIES...but whatever they are called they are very special to us alcoholics...I'm into day 3 and I hope to make it..today I've been saved from taking the first drink... I think I have to get rid of my wine glasses.I have an honest to goodness collectiion and I know it does me no good having them around.. It's time for them to go.... "Kelly M"...Good for you ending an abusive relationship..my ex.husband was very abusive...verbally and Physically....but not until after we were married...started immediately after the so called Honeymoon...my second husband was the nicest man ever...when he died I lost a lot... I'm in Alaska because it was where he wanted me to come...I met a man here one and half after his death and there was an immediate attraction..he too is a good man and I have no guilt...we are getting married sometime soon..we've been together exactly one year...but I don't want to marry him until he can understand that my drinking is a serious problem for me..he doesn't see it...says a glass of wine now and then is OK...not for me and I don't want to be a problem for him ever or hurt him..I've told him my story, but he says everything is OK as far as he is concerned..Kelly.. wait for the Good and decent man... they're out there...meeting him was Maybe that's why I'm here, before him I was resigned to be alone the rest of my life...but I guess God had other plans...I'm happy that you are staying sober too..I want to get back to where I was a few years ago..If I did it once..I pray I can do it again...I'm really tired of telling myself when I slip "Whoops you did it AGAIN"..and I hate the feelings that come with it... Again....congratulations to all the winners who posted today...it sounds like everyone is working sooooo hard....God Bless you all He's always been there for me...but I don't alwyas do his will...and I get into trouble when I follow my own.. really unexpected...but it happened.


Member: Jane C.
Location: Alaska
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 02:26 AM

Comments

Jane C..still an alcoholic...the last statement in my post was out of context...don't know how it got there...It belongs somewhere telling how I met Mike.."Unexpected, but it happened" ...


Member: Jane C.
Location: Alaska
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 02:48 AM

Comments

Jane C..alcoholic..."April" you are doing it right If you want and need help with alcohol...I'm new again, but foolishly don't go to meetings.. at least not yet...I went to meetings many years ago and stayed sober 18 years before I had my setback...I you are going to meetings you are doing the right thing...I remember my first meeting...I felt out of place and as if I was different...not like the others..I soon learned the truth... but the first time was so hare...I remember actually shaking when I walked in the door...all these people laughing and hugging..I didn't know what to do first or to just run out the door...a man came over to me as asked if I needed "Help"..I said YES...and he led me to a table of women,,,who became my close friends after a few months of meetings..( However, I never got over the uncomfortable feeling of hugging so many people...I wasn't raised in a touchy, feely family ) and so help me I felt GUILTY hugging these people when it was never done at home...and I also felt, after a long time of sobriety, that a lot of it wasn't sincere...you really have to be sure who you want to spend your time with in AA..we're all different, but we all drank differently and had different lifestyles..so you'll have to find your niche with people you can relate to other than having a drinking problem...GO TO MEETINGS.. and I wish you all the good things that sobriety will bring to you... TRy to read what's posted on this site...even if you can't read it all at one time...I love reading all the great things these good folks have to say..come back April...


Member: Tracy
Location: Essex, England
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 04:41 AM

Comments

((JANE)) Thank you for your post it has helped me today.


Member: Jan BB
Location: Paris, France
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 07:30 AM

Comments

Hi everyone, welcome to anyone new or feel's new. I have found many sponsor's and each one offered me something to use within my sobriety, my new of lving, without drugs or alcohol. You know, as long as I have kept one sober day next to another sober day and willing to extend my best effort and ability to the 12 steps, this thing keeps on working. The acronym, HOW, honesty, open mindnes and willingness has kept the ball rolling forward. ((Susan A.)) I truly like your style, I'm inspired! I get so much from everyone here; staying tachable to hear the message, thank you and have a good, sober 24! HOPE for ((Everyone, janbbparis@yahoo.com


Member: J-Rae
Location: N.D.
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 07:40 AM

Comments

(((Everyone)))....J-Rae, here;Alcoholic. When I came into AA 4 yrs ago, it was through a treatment center. They drug my sorry butt to meetings of AA, and HIGHLY SUGGESTED I get a sponsor, if even a temporary one, before I got out of treatment. Well, I'd tried several times through the years staying sober on my own, and THAT surely didn't work. Maybe, just maybe these people knew more than ME? So, I did get a temporary sponsor. She did not demand I do everything she said, nor demand I worship her. She DID offer suggestions that had worked for her, and when I tried them, they worked for me, too. Later, I found a permanent sponsor, who took me through the Big Book, the 12 x 12, and other AA appproved literature. We meet once a week, which helps to keep me accountable. She knows me well. She WILL call me on my BS, if need be, LOVINGLY so. This is a WE program, people. She told me to take my problems and crap and 'dump' them with her, and to take my solutions to AA. (Believe me, this greatly improved the quality of those meetings, as I'm sure those people at AA meetings were really greatful when I stopped living in problems and started living in the SOLUTION). The AA program as outlined in the Big Book speaks of one drunk passing on their experience, strength and hope with each other, that we all may find a Power Greater than ourselves. In attending meetings, it really shows, those who have, and don't have, a sponsor. An oldtimer I know said, "AA shows me what to do; what works, and also has taught me what NOT to do." I have seen those with sponsors living this life, and meeting life's challenges with great courage. Those without sponsors seem to be spinning around, 'white knuckling' it, and MOST end up drinking again, or are epitomies of what 'dry' drunks are. I surely don't want whatever it is that they have. On the other hand, I see those with sponsors living this program, not seeing sobriety as an event, but a process, and they have a glow and serenity about them that I DO want. God is my "ULTIMATE" authority. If I've tried a suggestion that my sponsor gave me to the best of my ability, and found it wanting, then I seek HIS guidance MORE. This has worked for me. Thank you for a great topic. Have a great 24...


Member: Jim
Location: PA
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 08:09 AM

Comments

" Each man is my superior. That I may learn from him." - Abraham Lincoln. I may be wrong but this quote might help many struggling with this question about sponsor/ no sponsor. As was said earlier God is our primary sponsor. What I think may have been missed here is that each of us individually is next on the list. If you have the first two on board the make up of the rest of the support staff doesn't matter. As someone entering day 5 again. It is the first two that keep fishing me out of the water when I fall in. All of you give me the enlightenment and hope necessary to keep my head above water when I fall in. Especially those of you having the hardest time with your sobriety. Know you are all in my prayers today.


Member: Melissa
Location:
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 10:28 AM

Comments

Hi, April, I remember going to one AA meeting and not thinking AA was the place for me. The bottom line for me was that I just wasn't ready to quit drinking again, and I don't think it would have mattered what anyone said, but when I read your post, I just wondered if you knew that all meetings are not the same, and another one may make you feel completely different. You could try going to every different meeting in your area and then decide. It's just a suggestion and I make it because for me my sobriety finally became an issue of life or death, and it was AA and the meetings that helped me choose life. Blessings and hope, whatever you choose, I hope you post again.


Member: Sheri A
Location: Calif
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 01:59 PM

Comments

sheri here, alcoholic. wow, with the comments above I'm almost afraid to join this group. I haven't stopped drinking yet and came here for some hope or guidance. This group sounds angry and pissed off! I once had a sponser and found out she was human and a sick person as well. However, even though she was sick, she gave of her heart and tried to help me. I got angry that she wasn't there for me all the time since I wanted to take all of her time. Sponsers do have a life outside of us. I am not drinking now and will pray to God that I can stay sober tonight. Please all of you pray for me as well. thanks for being here.


Member:
Location:
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 02:29 PM

Comments

Sheri in Cali---Are you drinking or not, I'm confused? You said you were and that you were not in the same sentence.


Member: Barb S.
Location: Canada
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 02:30 PM

Comments

Hi, everyone! Barb here, alcoholic. I have an unusual problem. I have been sober for over a year ( 13 months) and have done so by remaining focused on my recovery, reading the BB and maintaining close healthy relationships with friends who are not alcoholic. My profession requires taking care of everyone else but for once I'm doing something solely for me. Because I have had a substance abuse problem for about two years my professional body requires that I enter into an agreement with them. They want me to establish a relationship with a female sponsor which I am trying to find but there is no AA in my community and I live in a remote area in northern Canada with the closest community being about 2 hours away. Female members are rare. This topic was timely for me. I don't really feel I need a sponsor as I have found others who are supportive and spiritually uplifting and this really works for me. However, this is something they want and I have to try to comply. Any suggestions? Thanks for your ongoing support. I really enjoy this site!


Member: Manure-Mike
Location: everywhere
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 02:37 PM

Comments

Hey Barb}} Send an e-mail to Pam---sobergirl91@hotmail.com ----- She'll be glad to give you some leads. I'd suggest to even do it by e-mail or whatever, but I'm sure Pam will give you some good ideas, it's right up her ally, if you will. Glad to hear from you and glad you're doing well. Your a nice example and I wish you well on your journey. Peace and Blessings for you dear lady..........


Member: mariab
Location: north florida
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 05:07 PM

Comments

Hi, everyone, this is mariab. Well, I lost the battle yesterday so I'm back to square one. That's ok. I'm new to this message board, too, for those other new people. Some individuals do sound ticked off and I have noticed quite sharp differences of opinion. Well, that's life and that's people. My advice is not to take what you don't like too seriously, there are a number of very good posts and the most important thing is that even if you haven't (or won't) find a sponsor, visiting this message board gives you a group to listen to, to sound off to, and to learn from. I've learned a number of things here and read some very inspiring words. I'm open to finding a sponsor, it seems more like finding a steady guide, but one isn't marrying them and can't expect perfection from anyone, anyway. I look forward to the day when I get the guts (and ability) to do a fourth step and to have the right person to talk to. Let's not drink, all those who post here who aren't sober. I'll work on me :)


Member: Sheri A
Location: Calif.
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 05:17 PM

Comments

Hi Sheri back. I drank last night and what I meant to say(hungover brain) is I am not drinking at this moment. I want to stop for good. So this is day 1 for me.


Member: Rich
Location: NE
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 08:03 PM

Comments

April G. I to went to my first meeting yesterday and I to felt it wasn't for me. But I made tohe mistake of sitting in the back and with my hearing problem I couldn't hear a damn thing. The folks there all seemed to know reach other(kind of a click. I went to the doctor today for my yearly checkup and told him about my drinking problem. He wants me to go to detox for a couple of days. I told him to forget it. I don't want the stigma. I want to try this on my own. Any advice? (22 hours so far without a drink)


Member: Jane C.
Location: Alaska
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 08:21 PM

Comments

Jane C.an alcoholic..(Mariab)..so you lost the battle...that was yesterday...this is a new day... just start over...A Doctor once told my husband to just keep trying to quit smoking and one day that he would...He did keep trying and he did finally quit...but he quit too late...Let's not let it be too late for all of us....(Sheri A)..with God's help you will get through the day...I'm only on day 4 and I know it's not from will power...It's almost like being on a diet..the first 3 days are the hardest...I'm still not working on losing the 5 pounds that I hate...and you have to know that it was the drinking that put them on...I always eat when I drink...but I can only work on one thing at a time and it's the drinking right now...and I PRAY that I make it to day 5...(Tracy) Thank you for your post...It's nice to know that we can help someone else..I don'tknow how I helped, it's enough to know that I did...stay with this site...one day I hope to get REALLY GOOD AND LONG SOBRIETY AGAIN...It's the most important thing in my life and I get really anxious when I think that I may not make it...I hope we all have a sober day today...we'll work on tomorrow when it gets here...God Bless you all...


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 11:10 PM

Comments

way to go Kelly, My life is pretty good right now, I pray a lot for my Son and right now he has a forced to be good and off the pot and speed but I am praying he finds out how much better his life will be clean and sober. My Computer is doing great and my Daughter is also changed a bunch so I'm very proud of her also, she has made a complete change in her life and is staying with her husband which is a very good man. My Son is working now 52 hours a week which makes my life a lot more peaceful hahaha. I found out my not drinking is a big step in showing him it can be done and he can make it if he only prays about it, I still have my days that tempt me but I know I can not drink, I know I have no control over the amount I drink and I know I am a alcoholic and must not drink, today is day 114 sober and boy have I lost a lot of weight since I stop the booze it destroys our liver which is what puts a layer of fat around our waist when we drink. God bless you all and good luck on staying sober to you all


Member: Kerry C
Location: TX (kerryctx@hotmail.com)
Date: July 17, 2003
Time: 11:19 PM

Comments

Rich don't mean to jump in a conversation but depending on your drinking history you might want to reconsider your doctors advice. It can be very dangerous to detox alone. About once a week I see a guy hauled off in an ambulance in convultions at the half way house where I attend meetings. The convultions usually set in around 24-48 hours after their last drink. Not everyone has those severe sypmtoms but if it weren't for them being at the 1/2 way house where 3 or 4 people can hold them down to keep them from injuring themselves until the ambulance arrives they could possible die. Folks as Carl C points out alcoholism is dead serious.


Member: AZbill
Location: Sierra Vista, Arizona
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 01:14 AM

Comments

Rich I concur with Kerry C. Alcoholic seizures are not to be fooled with. I have seen a few at meeting and EMT's had to be called. Please go... stigma or not... is your pride worth your life? az-bill@mindspring.com


Member: Nick G
Location: TX
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 02:20 AM

Comments

Finding a sponsor…ha-ha Nick alcoholic and a truly grateful RECOVERED member of alcoholics anonymous. This is the prime reason our fellowship is having such low percentages of recovery. We need responsible men and women who have had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics and to practice these principles in all our affairs. Be responsible and seek these prospects out. We don’t have time to wait till we are all comfortable with one another (especially the new comer). Our fellowship is dying. New comers I pray someone approaches you and offers you what was so freely given to us. Don’t doubt the power of God when he puts this person in front of you. The time is now to sit down, shut up about your chicken shit problems, listen, follow some direction and do some writing. You are on your way to a new and wonderful life. Alcohol used to be our solution. It says in the big book liquor was but a symptom. We must get down to causes and conditions. So we must stop addressing the problem with the problem. Here you will find a power that will help you solve your problem. That power is that of God. May you find him now.


Member: Marsha A
Location: Florida
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 08:07 AM

Comments

Ok I have one and only one question. I got sober 15 years ago. I had nothing left, no one to turn to. A few months ago I started drinking again. Things happened that I did not like and now all those things ended up fine, but since I picked up the first drink I am having trouble putting away. My question is I have a new life based on sobriety and I can not expect my new husband of 3 years to let me go to AA. AA takes up too much of your life. I belonged to a 12 step group before, (for 10 years). I need to know a way to stay sober without all the extra time. I am not willing to lose this husband and all the grandchildren we have together to all the time AA says I have to put into it. I would rather die. You gotta know that the 1st time I had nothing. Now I have everything. Please give me and answer. And Mr. Carl C do you reside in Florida? I think I know you.


Member: Jim l.
Location: CT
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 09:39 AM

Comments

At times I ask myself is all this worth it I'm going to die anyway. Big deal I died sober.


Member: Awestruck
Location:
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 09:48 AM

Comments

Marsha, that is a frightening post. More proof that alcohol causes mental illness in the form of twisted, irrational thinking in alcoholics who drink it... Marsha, please re-read your post. Then insert the word cancer in place of alcoholism. You never did ask a question, except the one regarding Carl, but your whole post made me think of Step Two. This can't be the real "you". This is the disease talking, thank you for letting me hear it. Every single possible blessing on your head, and lots of love as you make your choices (which are so hard to make under the influence.) Cunning, baffling and powerful, all right.


Member: Susan A.
Location: Vernon, CT
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 11:51 AM

Comments

Hi All, I'm Susan and I'm an Alcoholic. To Marsha A., I'm glad you wrote. As you say, you have your new life BECAUSE you got sober. Without sobriety, you may loose these things (not to mention -yourself-). You and your sobriety are important. Please reconsider...your first experience was based on 'then' and worked 'then'. You can build a new sobriety AND have your new life, husband, grandchildren, etc. Lots of us do it. Think about going to 1 hr meetings in the mornings or afternoons, if evenings don't work for you. Be creative and please get sober again. We want and need you here.


Member: Barb S
Location: Canada
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 01:27 PM

Comments

Rich- It is not unusual to feel as you do about "detox", however, having seen lots of DT's and knowing what can happen during the process, I must encourage you to seek medically supervised detoxification for your own safety. The last thing someone going through detox needs is worrying whether detox itself will kill them. Once you survive that process you will truly be free to enter into a meaningful recovery.Of course your need for detox depends upon your ingestion pattern and only you will know that. I often think that we have to consciously make a decision- Do we want to live? or Do we want to die? If someone with cancer was told that all they had to do to live was to stop doing a certain behaviour what do you think they would give up, their life or the behaviour? Seems simple doesn't it?


Member: Kathleen
Location: Florida
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 01:28 PM

Comments

Hello (((Everyone))) Good topic and a lot of good shares. I had one of those seizures from withdrawing from alcohol and had I not been in detox when i had it would probably be dead today. I found my sponser in that detox when she was chairing an AA meeting there. She had the look of peace and serenity in her eyes and she had what I wanted. She helped lead me through the steps, never downgraded me or ordered me around. She only shared her expierence, strength and hope with me....and I'm so very grateful it worked out that way. I believe that sponsership is a personal choice, however, it was my best thinking that got me to the rooms of AA so how in the world could I think my way through the steps alone. No way...yeah, I have had some bad expierences with sponsers, however, a fellow who spoke one time really cleared it up for me. He said, "don't put all your faith and trust in the people of AA cause we are all sick people trying to get well, put your faith and trust in the program of AA, the 12 steps... Welcome to all who are new here and thanks to all for sharing.. Kathleen


Member: DebLH
Location: WI
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 01:41 PM

Comments

Marsha- Thanks for reaching out,you wrote "I can not expect my new husband of 3 years to let me go to AA. AA takes up too much of your life" If your husband loves you and you love him, how can you NOT do what you know works to save your life and all that you fear losing?what are the options??? Please get help, we can't do it alone!! So much has been said about sponsorship, for and against. When I was sober long enough to get my brain to start to function, this type of discrepancy really bothered me. I was looking for "the" right way to do this sober thing and it seemed I couldn't get a straight answer. This caused me to step back from meetings for a while and during that time of soul searching I realized that "my program" was just that "my program". I realized that finding the "right" answer wasn't going to happen. I had to figure out what worked for ME. I've had times when I've had a sponsor and I didn't call her, I've had times when I didn't have a sponsor and I used meetings to help me find the truth within myself. I think the greatest thing I gained from having a sponsor was the ability to trust. The trust I placed in one person grew so that I could eventually trust myself and then others. (April) I also didn't feel like I belonged at my first meeting, but like people, all meetings are different. I forced myself to go until one day I realized I was no longer forcing myself but looking forward to my meetings. I'd also like to say Thanks for sharing to all of you celebrating your AA milestones, be it days, months or years. Your success helps me to remember where I came and fills my life with gratitude for this great program of recovery. God Bless


Member: Early G.
Location:
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 02:30 PM

Comments

Early Girl here...day 5 for me. Very emotional now (would bust into tears in a meeting) so I haven't gone to one yet. I would really like someone to shoulder the burden of listening to me talk about how diferent every perception I have is without alcohol in my body. I know my life will be better without drinking, but I don't have a direction right now. I just want to see how different I am, and who I am, without it. I don't love myself drunk, but maybe there is someone inside I will love enough to really want better things for. It's worth a try and if a sponser could validate to me that this "feeling better" is not all in my head (because I lost touch with reality a while ago) then I say I am interested in finding one. Thanks to all who encourage. It is a private battle, but it is comforting to know that I am not alone in this.


Member: Sandy
Location:
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 02:44 PM

Comments

Barb S. If someone with cancer was told that all they had to do to live was to stop doing a certain behaviour what do you think they would give up, their life or the behaviour?I think they would give up their life they still smoke


Member: Becky B.
Location: Virginia
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 03:21 PM

Comments

Hi,Im becky. I have 2 days sober after a relapse. Interesting topic. I do have a sponsor,and think sponsors are a great idea.too bad I didn't listen to mine. Right now she is out of town and doesnt know i drank again. lucky me, one of here other sponsees,with a lot of time,stepped up and is filling in for her as far as helping me,until she gets back. I feel very grateful that i made it back in one piece. Not everybody does.


Member: Kari B
Location: California
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 03:49 PM

Comments

I'm brand new to AA. After a disastrous Christmas I decided to stop drinking for real. I've slipped twice since then. A couple of weeks ago, I put away about 9 bottles in 4 days and then next morning, I called a recovery center and AA. I went to my first AA meeting two days ago, so I don't have a sponsor yet. A lady approached me and she seemed to be someone that I could really relate to. And yet, I have this wall. I don't want a sponsor. I don't want someone calling me when I don't want them to. I just want to figure this stuff out on my own. I know that what I am saying is in itself the problem --- that I've been trying to do this on my own for so long. How do I get past this thinking and let someone be a friend. All my current friends have no clue as to the extent of my alcohol problems and I just want to remain anonymous, but if I get a sponsor then I am no longer truly anonymous, am I?


Member: Jane C.
Location: Alaska
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 05:17 PM

Comments

Jane C. an alcoholi...(Marsha B) I know how you must feel after 15 years of sobriety...I slipped after 18 yrs..when my husband was diagnosed with incurable lung cancer...he died 2 yrs. later..I picked up the drink again around the second year of his illness..stress.. being tired all the time...caring for him alone..(My decision)..I really thought a glass of wine now and then would be fine..in the beginning it was fine..you know the rest...I also had a problem with him when I wanted to go to AA..he didn't see that I had a problem so I kept putting of what I felt I needed to do...I kept saying I had a problem.. he said he couldn't see it..he's say things like "It's ok to drink a little to much now and then"..so I kept it up until I started to do it alone..then I stood my ground and just told him that I had to do the AA meetings...not just for me, but for him...it wasn't easy at times.. but he did see a big change in me.. .I finally slowed down the drinking and stopped completely before I relocated to Alaska...I was free of it for about a year...the I flew back home for a class reuion and I was petrified of it all..the flying alone again...meeting old friend that I hadn't seen in over 25 years not being able to have some fun.. just everything..so I had wine at the reunion and ever since I've been very upset with myself..and I too am on day 5..mostly because of this site...I think I will be so embarressed when I have to admit that I failed again...try just taking the bull by the horns and discuss it with your husband..tell him how important it is for both of you...you won't lose him..I didn't lose mine.because of meetings..Also maybe just try 2 or 3 a week...I still haven't the courage to do a meeting yet...I have to work up to it...but you know as well as I do that there is so much support there that you just really want sobriety even more than you realize..andyou will make it again..I pray God will Bless you with his Grace...GO !


Member: Ethan T
Location: Mass
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 05:30 PM

Comments

Hi all. Day #5 for me. Guess by comparison to many here I'm a high-bottom drunk (a 'light weight' according to some of my recovering alcoholic friends), which is how I justify designing and following my own recovery program, based on the 12 steps, with no f/f meetings or human sponsor. (I know, I know, classic alcoholic: "I don't need no stinkin help!"). I'm also a Christian and trying to actively practice a radical reliance on the Lord. He promised to carry me, and I'm putting Him to the test, cause man, I'm a total screw-up on my own when I block him out - but that's a great topic for another website. Anyway, I'm definitely no expert, but agree that this is a life or death matter, with death being a much more likely and imminent possibility for some then others. It sounds like getting physically to meetings daily, and also finding someone to talk with about the program outside of meetings, is how so many here who once drank lots finally quit and now stay sober. My thinking (remember, I'm sick) is that if we've seriously tried to quit on our own or following other programs and it didn't/doesn't work, and their way has worked for them, it's a program worth whole-heartedly trying. Pretty silly to end up a stiff in a coffin prematurely from a disease that can be cured (made dormant?) if we'll just find the courage to go talk with and listen to a bunch of other sick people. Best wishes for a sober evening, and thanks for letting me ramble!


Member: Rich
Location: NE
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 05:44 PM

Comments

On the issue of detox. You are scaring me now. I stopped drinking a couple of other times in my life and I didn't get the "DT's". Mabey it depends on how much we drink that brings that about. I am an alcoholic(for sure)but I don't drink from morning till night(usually). But I drink every day except during lent when I was a churchgoer. The first thing I do when I get home is grab a beer and I keep one close to me until I go to bed. I'm not a fall down type of drunk although on some occasions I drive knowing my blood alcohol level would land me in jail. BTW does anyone know how many beers it takes to reach .08. Thanks you guys for caring about me it helps. Blessings to you and those you love.


Member: Amanda S
Location: Tejas
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 06:24 PM

Comments

hi my name is amanda i am an alcoholic addict i've been sober 12 days and i too reached a "high bottom" i got a sponsor two days ago and it made me feel so much better i'm going to meetings everynight and taking it one day at a time i think sponsorship is great it is the tradition! anyway... that's my thoughts but i'm pretty new to the program love to all as


Member:
Location:
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 08:46 PM

Comments

aa won't solve all your problems. Unless drinking is your only problem. My crazy thinking again the older I get the less I care about anything.I'm not trying to scare anybody I'm just a sick person who doesn't know anymore.I should go to the nut doctor but I'v been there and its hasn't helped. I guess when they were dealing out the cards they were missing some cards out of my deck.I know what I half to do but its very hard for me just to get going.They say in aa its gets easyer "DRINKING' yes I agree it does but sometimes life gets harder. I'v been sober a long time I'm still a very sick person


Member: Ethan T
Location: MA
Date: July 18, 2003
Time: 11:51 PM

Comments

(No name) Real sorry to hear about the hard time you're having. You said you're sick and you've tried going to a doc - maybe there are other docs you can try? I think most any reputable mental health facility should be able to point you in the right direction. Seems they should be able to direct you to an MD who may prescribe some meds, or a mental health specialist for counseling, or even a minister who may be able to help. The meds available these days help lots of people and I've learned first hand to not underestimate God. You're in my prayers.


Member: Kari B
Location: California
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 12:52 AM

Comments

((Ethan T.)) I'm on Day 5 also. I hope that we can both make tomorrow Day 6. Stick with me and we can count the days together. I know I have a good life ahead of me because with each passing sober day life is going to get better and better. The difference for me this time is that I have actually stepped foot into an AA meeting for the first time and also that this time I am consciously thinking about how this will not be easy, that I have to be more willful about telling myself, "no" to that first drink.


Member: Kari B
Location: California
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 12:57 AM

Comments

((Amanda S)) I'm rooting for you. I will be even happier when I reach Day 12 and WHEN (not if) I reach Day 30, 60, and 90 I am going to celebrate (not with booze though). It is so strange, but now that I found out we get tokens for reaching those days, I am bound and determined to collect all those tokens. I quit for 9 months when I was pregnant for the most part. But had a drink in my hand the minute I got home from the hospital. I knew that I had only quit for my baby's health. Now I want to do this for my own health and spirit as well as for my family's well being.


Member: Kerry C
Location: TX (kerryctx@hotmail.com)
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 02:04 AM

Comments

Congrats to everyone on another sober day. Seems a lot have 5 days here. The detox period should be over and the mind defogging a bit. Ethan it might be easier to use the program already designed, it has worked for millions around the world ;) Rich for a 160 lb man 4 drinks will get you 0.94 Well it is the weekend again. Remember if we don't take that first drink, the craving won't start. Wishing everyone a safe and sober weekend. Thx to everyone for being here to help keep me sober.


Member: Kerry C
Location: TX (kerryctx@hotmail.com)
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 02:08 AM

Comments

Sorry Rich a typo I meant to type 0.094, 0.94 would get you death.


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 09:15 AM

Comments

Good Morning All, I know this will go under last weeks but Happy Sunday to everyone. Welcome, Becky, Ethan, Kari, Amanda and anyone else I missed. Thank you Jane C. for the supportive comment. Moving away from abuse can be hard but I'm getting healthier and it is coming naturally. It is great you are back and keep coming back and letting us know how your doing. Diane, good to hear everything is going good for you and your family. For everyone that thinks this is an easy program, it is. The hard part is putting the time and energy into it. It only works if you work it and have willingness. Ethan, I'm a Christian also. My religion never got me sober though even though I prayed and went to Church every week. I did get sober by going to AA meetings and embracing the program. It's not between my God and me but About powerlessness and learning how to let God drive for me. He was always there I never allowed him to take control. On siezures, I had one about a week out of rehab. I was DTing bad and needed rehab but everyone is different. If you want to be safe go to a rehab to detox. My siezure was quite serious and luckily happened in front of AA friends. I got really banged up from hitting the sidewalk, 7 stitches in my head and a black eye. I never felt a thing, it was painless while happening and I don't remember it until I came to in the ambulance. I saw another AA friend have one a few weeks ago at a meeting and it was scary. Be safe. Early girl, keep coming and reading, you sound willing which is good. Jim on thinking dying by alcohol is easy, well that is not my experience. It was a slow painful death and I finally surrendered. Keep coming back....kay. I have a wonderful life now and the promises are coming true that the Big Book talks about. I had to be as willing as the dying to get it. Now that I am getting it I want to share that it does get better, much better. Have Faith and Grace will follow. I have a full life and with that I'm off to a wedding. A couple friends from AA are tying the knot. Lets all stay sober just for today just because we are all worth it! Kelly


Member: TOM
Location: NY
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 10:44 AM

Comments

Doesn't seem possible, but day 34 here. Rich, I could have written what you did. That was me exactly. Best of luck to all


Member: Kari B
Location: California
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 12:46 PM

Comments

Starting Day 6 here. Wow, made through a Friday night without drinking. It's been a long time since I've done that, but here I am on Saturday morning without a hangover. Don't quite know what to do with myself today. LOL


Member: Early G.
Location:
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 12:54 PM

Comments

Day six here...day five had a rough spot in the afternoon. I called everyone I could think of to just talk, and get my mind off of it. Everyone was busy, and the fact that no one knows what I'm doing in not drinking doesn't explode the support resource pool. This made the topic of having a sponser very pertinent. It would help to at least know that there is someone out there who doesn't want me to drink through those rough spots, even if they were unavailable at that time. ((Kelly)) thank-you for the comment. I am willing, and because I fully know what a lifestyle in the drunk had gotten me, I'm pretty sure I could just expect more of the same if I kept drinking. If you want something you've never had before, you have to do something you've never done before...A great 1440 to all.


Member: Ethan T
Location: MA
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 04:06 PM

Comments

Kari B - Day #6 for me, too. Don't you love the clear head in the morning and the increased energy, etc? As tough as a Friday night in the summertime is without 2 or 3 or 12 beers, it sure is worth it. I have our 3 kids all day today by myself (wife's working), so I really need all the extra energy. Took them on a bike ride this morning, then to the park, then back home for Popsicle's and to plan a family road trip to the museum tomorrow. They're a blast when I can keep up with them. Thanks everyone for the helpful, hopeful words. Yeah, I'm aware I'm not 'doing it right' by not going to f/f meetings or getting a human sponsor. But for me, hearing about your experiences and sharing some of mine with you seems to be a big and helpful (and new) supplement to the other things I'm doing this time. You all are really helping me. Kelly, thanks. I know it's against the rules to get Biblical, but you may appreciate this. Several times over the past few years I've quit drinking for several weeks. To stay sober 1 or 2 of those times I both relied on the Lord and (and this is the biggie for me) managed to be somewhat obedient to Him - and low and behold, I walked around experiencing the 'peace that surpasses all human comprehension'. It was awesome - absolutely nothing seemed to get to me - even though I was going through lots of tough stuff. It felt a little like some drugs I'd done in the past. And like the drug experiences, I eventually managed to use that feeling of strength and calm to justify drinking (i.e. "Hey, I'm filled with the strength of the Lord, I bet I can drink and it won't even hardly affect me!!!" Duh.) Anyway, I'm working my hybrid plan to again get close to Him, and get high on His love, and enjoy it one day at a time. I really believe I can do it, cause I'm not doing it alone this time. And if one day I need to add f/f AA meetings to achieve that goal, I will. It'll be a small price to pay to again have that peace. (Hope I don't get booted from here for sounding 'religious' - but after reading Bill's story in the BB, I think he was talking about the same thing I'm trying to say.) Thanks for reading all this and for being here. God bless and best wishes to all for a sober Saturday.


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 04:07 PM

Comments

Hi Diane here day 116 sober now I've read most the post and Marsha A wants to know if it is possible to stop drinking without going to AA meetings well I am here and sober and not went to one meeting, I use the site as my meeting place and come as often as I can so yes Marsha you can stop drinking with out meetings. My God is my sponsor, I do realize that most folks need the meetings but it is possible to stay sober, read the BB book and pray about it but stop drinking is the step to take at least it was for me.


Member: Kari
Location: California
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 04:26 PM

Comments

((Ethan)) Sounds like we have alot in common. One of my main motivations for getting sober was because life was getting too difficult to manage now that I have to run after a little one all day. I just couldn't do it with a hangover. I hated how I felt - like I couldn't wait until she went to bed at night so that I could open the bottle and start in. It made me feel like a horrible mother even though I know I'm not. We ALWAYS did fun, educational things all day long even though my head was killing me and my body was screaming for a drink. Anyhow, I totally know what you mean about the extra energy. It is very rewarding. It makes me wonder why I would ever consider taking another drink. But then an hour later, I will be thinking about how good it would taste and if I think about it a second too long, I feel like I am going to run to the store and get SOMETHING. It is funny because I always considered myself a high-functioning alky because I graduated from college and graduate school with a 4.0 both times although I drank my way through it. I had published research papers in journals. I also received a very prestigious award in my profession and I kept telling myself that I am not an alcoholic if it is not holding me back professionally. But as I was saying, I was under the illusion that I was a high functioning alky, but now that I have a clear head after 6 days, I am looking around the house and I am thinking, "holy crap, who was I kidding, this place is a mess, I'M a mess!" Running after 3 kids can't be easy when your wife is working all day. I know because my husband has been in Iraq for over 10 months and I have been here alone raising my daughter. In fact, that has been an excuse for drinking ("It's OK to drink and forgive myself because I'm under alot of stress") Then I realized that the drinking was truly just making everything worse. I also understand about not wanting to get a sponsor. I tend to just want to do this on my own and not want someone breathing down my neck. I'm just going to go to the AA meetings and listen. I've been to two so far and I haven't spoken a single word other than my name.


Member: Ethan T
Location: MA
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 05:20 PM

Comments

(Kari) You're right - we do have lots in common. I drank my way to a grad degree and achieved some success in my profession. Big ego, ability to function at fairly high level despite the raging hangover, intellectually understanding that abusing alcohol is just plain stupid (especially with kids to care for), and at least for me, now understanding booze keeps my best answer of all to everything (God) out of my reach all still don't keep me from fantasizing about how great a cold 1 or 12 would taste. I get so disgusted with myself one minute, and catch myself zeroing in on a plan to do a liquor store run the next. Such a knucklehead. And the excuses - wow. My spouse isn't in Iraq, but I imagine that's real compelling. That would fall into the "poor me, I deserve it" category, if it were me in your shoes. I think I've got a few hundred excuses, but all seem to fall into either the "I did something good/hard, so I earned it" (i.e. I made it to Friday night - time to celebrate!), or the "I'm dealing with a difficulty, so I deserve it" (i.e. business stinks since 9/11, I deserve it for putting up with hard times") categories. In either case, I've always convinced myself that "I can handle it". Such B.S. Fortunately, I've got some pretty serious indications that I can't handle it, and it's time to make some changes. Thanks for your post. Let's get through all of today sober for the kids - they really deserve it.


Member: Stacy
Location: West Coast
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 05:24 PM

Comments

Hi All, Stacy, 103 days for me. (((Kari, Ethan, Kelly...all newcomers)). Hang in there. I can remember posting on this site on day 5, 6, 7 etc. I can honestly say today that it is easier. I am used to waking up and my head not hurting! I am used to driving a car and not worrying about the poss. DUI or my breath. I love having more patience for my family! Kari, you and I were in the same alcoholic cycle. Drinking and caring for my 2 little ones got WAY UNMANAGEABLE. I drank lightly while cooking them dinner and kicked it into high gear when I put them to bed. I don't miss those days. I do still have moments when I think, "Man, I wish I was not an alcoholic and could have that drink right now." But today I am relying on God. I am working very hard to do His will, not mine and things are getting better. Life is a rollercoaster today. Up and down all the time, but overall, my life is improving. My relationships are improving. And it's because of God and this program of AA! Nothing has worked until I tried this. It's a miracle. Keep coming back.


Member: Kerry C
Location: TX (kerryctx@hotmail.com)
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 05:26 PM

Comments

Ethan, Don't take me wrong I wasn't implying your way was wrong. I was just trying to give you a gentle nudge. You are absolutely correct in your understanding of Bills story. In fact you have a better handle on it than many I have met in AA with years of sobriety. The Big Book is a set of instruction designed to get us closer to our higher power, because without spiritual help we are doomed. The big taboo about religon in AA has to do with the fact that when religon is mentioned many remember being forced or threatened to believe or be doomed from earlier experiences. Bill W. had the same notion at first and the generalization of a Power Greater than Ourselves becomes an avenue that many who would had never given AA a chance are able to recover. So don't apologize for your convictions just understand that many find it offensive. The thing that is nice about f2f meetings is that we find friends that understand where we are coming from. There will be times in sobriety when you really just need to talk to someone face to face that understands. It is so much easier if we develop friendships as time goes by. Sometimes we just need to talk to someone on the phone when we have hard times. Alcoholics like to isolate and withdrawl from the world. How can we let our light shine for others to see from behind a computer screen? Alcoholics are uniquely suited to help other alcoholics. That in a nutshell is all sponsorship is about. Keep reading that Big Book and you will see that it is mentioned many times that we must work with other alcoholics to maintain our sobriety. That wonderful experience that you had when walking with your higher power is meant to be freely given to others as we have received it freely.


Member: Ethan T
Location: MA
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 05:52 PM

Comments

(Kerry C) Thank you. I realy appreciate your thoughtful comments, and for some reason, the "letting our light shine for others to see from behind a computer screen?" question brought tears to my eyes. Damn emotions. Thanks - you've given me things to think about.


Member: Jane C.
Location: Juneau, Alaska
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 06:05 PM

Comments

jANE C., Alcoholic.( KaryB..EarlyG.. and EtanT )..I'm on day 6 along with you..and so happy that we all have made it this far..after day 7 ( and I Pray God that I make it )..I think it maybe OK to stop posting days for a while..at least until day 30...For KaryB..years ago when I first went to meetings..I was so totally petrified I didn't speak up either for a while...in fact they used to tell newcomers to "Shut Up and Just Listen" first 30 days..but if I did that, I probably would never open my face...but I spoke up only when I needed immediate help... (EthanT)...I think you probably are much more a spiritual person, than a religious one..I too read from the Bible...the only one in my family that does..they believe in the punishing God..I was raised that way, but even as a young one, I never believed that..I ALWAYS believed in the Forgiving God..and I know that it's been only Him that has gotten me through life..my drinking started because of an abusive first marriage that after 3 kids..I knew I HAD TO GET OUT..it took a while..but I finally did it.. Sobriety came in my second marraige There were no more excuses for drinking...I could talk about God all day,..and the Grace he has given me, but my family doesn't listen... my boyfriend is the only one who truly is..in fact the thing that really hooked me was his trying to get a Bible study group together in his neighborhood... (Lots of Drug Addicts and Alcoholics there),, however he could only get a couple to really care..the rest fell by the wayside..Mike is a good man...every one in his building has much respect for him..as do I..he goes downtown nearly everyday to check on a couple of men that he has helped in the past..he also has made it possible for me to go to Church again..it was hard for me to go alone..He now goes with me. ( are we supposed to talk about things like this? ) (EarlyG) we all made it to day 6 and hopefully we'll get through day 7...this site is like a Godsend to me and I'm sure too the rest of us..I hope to get back to meetings one day soon...but for now sharing what I can with you all is really a joy for me...I check this site at least 3 times a day to see if new posts were added..it gives me lots of hope..we're not alone..ever.May God help us all through this day..


Member: Kerry C
Location: TX (kerryctx@hotmail.com)
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 06:09 PM

Comments

Ok last post for the week folks...(it is almost over haha ;) This has been a ruff week for me and I really needed everyone here. Believe me you all have helped me more than you can imagine. I needed to post more than usual to help me get through this week. I just do the typing my higher power provides the words. See ya all next week...120 days since my last drink...and it is better than I could have ever imagined. Thx all.


Member: Kari
Location: California
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 09:04 PM

Comments

((Jane C)) Thank you for your kind thoughts. I am a little confused about the part where you said, "I think it is OK to stop posting days for awhile, at least until after Day 30." Do you mean that you don't want us to say how many days, or do you mean that you don't need to yourself? The reason I ask, is because right now, counting the days is the only thing that is helping. It is a huge motivation for me to see the number get higher with each passing day. ((Ethan)) Also wanted to mention that I admire your spiritual or religious devotion, whichever anyone wants to call it. I have also had spiritual experiences in the past that have been way better than any drug or alcohol. But in the past I have also fooled myself into believing that alcohol brought me closer to God. I also convinced myself that I drink because I am different than other people, people don't understand me, I'm too smart, too complex Yada, yada, yada. All a load of crap. If I were so smart I would not continue to do the same damaging things over and over - namely drinking to oblivion. ((Kerry C)) I tried your suggestion about eating a little candy. Sorry to tell you that it actually made my craving for alcohol worse. The craving was so intense that for about an hour today, I was thinking I am never going to make it through the day. I was fantasizing about every step of pouring a glass. My conclusion is this: eating sugar begets alcohol cravings and drinking alcohol begets sugar cravings. I just think they go hand in hand. The healthier I eat the less I crave the alcohol. I guess there is no more question in my mind as to whether or not I truly have a problem. I mean I spent pretty much all day thinking about alcohol. I don't think a NONalcoholic would do that. Sorry for such a long post.


Member: Ethan T
Location: MA
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 09:43 PM

Comments

(Kari) Good job surviving the sugar roller coaster today! I'm guessing that surviving close calls like that actually builds up resilience over time. I had the same experience with sugar. Like you, best for me is a healthy diet - lots of fruits & veggies, also for me: exercise (key) and then a good book to look forward to at end of day. Not to mention praying without ceasing, then praying some more; and now, this site. Glad you got through it. By the way, I also went through the 'closer to God when drunk' thinking, as well as 'I'm not like other people' thoughts (still revert to that one often, nut case that I am). Amazing how creative those demons can be. (Jane C) I was also raised with the image of a stern, angry God. Didn't learn how far from the truth that is til I arrogantly decided to put my education to use and prove to myself with solid historical evidence that the Bible / God / Jesus was actually all an elaborate hoax. Long story short - I shocked myself by reaching a very different conclusion. Boy had I been clueless. Well, I'm thinking I should cool it with the postings for a while - I'm gonna wear out my welcome. But this site sure has helped today. Thanks all.


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: July 19, 2003
Time: 10:33 PM

Comments

I found that same thing (Kari) I have to stay off starch and sugar I use stevia cause it don't raise my sugar levels up I think a lot of alcoholic are also carboholics if that is a word lol..... I also heard chocolate is not good it makes you crave or remember the high ...I just stay away from it and eat healthy and then I seem to do ok