Member: David D.
Location: Southern Illinois
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 7:34:05 AM

Comments

Good- Morning, powerlesness,the fact that I am powerless over so many things,,comeing to terms acceptance that the needed power is not available on my oun resorces..what a devastating blow it is at first untill I REALIZE THIS IS THE THING THAT STARTS ME ON A LIFE OF FREEDOM. Step One thats the topic.... thanks for letting me share.


Member: Jim R.
Location: Pennsylvania
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 8:41:02 AM

Comments

Powerless?... Yeah, in many ways. I know this might sound like A.A. heresy, but in many other ways, I've been very powerful - a one-man turbine. I've been a wrecking ball when it comes to my family and my life, and truly powerful when it comes to destruction of things I cherish and love. I guess that's sell will run riot. I'm finding, however, that turning my will over doesn't destroy that will, or that power. What I'm actually doing is turning my creativity, my formerly destructive tendencies and my chaotic nature into a positive by applying it as the God of my understanding intended, rather than as an answer to my own selfish desires.


Member: AnilG
Location: MtVernon,IL
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 9:38:30 AM

Comments

I am an alcholic and an addict when it came to drinking and alcohol I was powerless everyone evening at 7pm I would start drinking like a clock no matter where I was sitting that urge came and i had to have drink in fact i planned everyhting according to my drinking schedule in mind picking out places where drinking wil be served and i could be there if it was a late event i would drink first before i would go tothese events.I was totally powerless over my drinking and drugs thanks to aa and alanon that i was introduced to HP and the only way to manage and treat my insanity.


Member: Maverick
Location: here and there -- I'm all over the place -- but oh so well grounded
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 9:57:08 AM

Comments

Thanks Jim R. from Pennsylvania, sort of. I appreciate what you say, but it's still acquiescing to the aa ideaology to an extent and looking at it from a negative angle. I know I have power over not only many things, but in specific ETOH. I never had to pick up that first drink either before I got sober or now that I've been sober a good-long period of time. I was NEVER forced to do it and while I may have had trouble stopping once I started, it doesn't change the fact that the very first drink was AALL my own fault and I have absolute power over not picking it up today as well as I did then. I also have the power to make a better choice than I did then and I've not only done so for quite a period of time, but know I will never do so again. I mean hell, I don't know what anyone else's definition of powerlessness over alcohol is, but I have total power over whether it goes into my body or not, yet obviously not ETOH itself as nobody has absolute control over outside entities, that's silly. Besides, there are North American treatment centers in Canada for the Native American's that skip this step for that very reason and many, many of them get and stay sober. Sort of defeats the equally-silly idea that "this is the only step we have to do 100%," now doesn't it? Matter of fact, they only use 4 of the steps at the place I'm referencing and it has world-wide respect because of its validity. The point is, we are all powerful over whether that ETOH goes into our bodies or not, regardless of whether you want to use the "cop-out" version of step one or not. In the end, it all comes to one thing in AA---do you or do you not put that ETOH in your system-period. If it was truly in "power" and controlling us, then the answer would be yes as it would never relinguish it's hold over us, WE do that ourselves, by and through the Grace and Power of God. Again, whether cognizant of it or not is irrelevant, that is still how it happens and the pathology doesn't change. Believe whatever you want, but this step is no more or less necessary than any other step and millions quit drinking without doing this one or any of them, so you tell me pal, what's "The Way?" The AA way? I think NOT! Step 1 is totally irrelevant, but thanks for bringing it up so I could point out the obvious facts........


Member: anonamous
Location: today
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 10:21:05 AM

Comments

its the principal of being powerless...the humility received from the honest admission of powerlessness..to me this is the very definition of alcoholism its what makes me an alcoholic i am powerless and i cannot stop or stay stopped. if i thought otherwise then i would either be in denial or not be an alcoholic im not argueing just stating my experience and im of the philosophy that experience is one of the best teachers howevwr not the only one


Member: Dogen Huxley
Location: This land is your land, this land is my land,....
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 10:58:17 AM

Comments

I think Step 1 is very fundamental in all the stpes. The dynamics is not really on the powerless side of it, but as the RECOGNITION that you have a DISEASE and that no matter what you do, this is your nature. Not unless I ADMIT that I have a this disease then there is no solution for it. Now this not only concerns alcohol but it LIFE in general, the world and how people treat each other. In my experience, bigotry, racism, elitism, prejudice, descrimination, ridicule, mockery, etc. works like this in society. When people ignore that there's actually a problem (because they don't want to start trouble or invite more trouble that has been coming to them or they have seen it done to other people and they don't want to be in their place, or glad to be not in their place) then the Social Disease is very malignant, alive and well. I have seen the best intentioned people with Institutions that are pro-poor, pro equal civil rights, and American Indians and Blacks living in 3rd World Conditions and even poor people in the 3rd World themselves, have this kind of mentality because that's what they learn well in school, their parents, the mass media. It how to survive in this world. Now you can't get these people to admit that they have a problem, that's why the problem or the disease is never treated, it exactly works in alcoholism. I've seen people die that I tried to 12 Step in coming into this program , because they would never admit that they have a problem let alone the admittance that they are alcoholics. It is actually their pride that holds on to such "Identity" of themselves, that they are cool, that they're so hip, that they are class, that they are "in" with the clicks, etc. It's the same thing with that social cancer I'm talking about. And not unless one will recognize that this disease is incurable no matter what you do or what the world with all its energies will do to attempt to cure it, will this disease be even addressed in the first place.


Member: Thaddeus R
Location: Atlanta
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 12:04:52 PM

Comments

I am free from the bondage of alcohol, no longer a slave to its power as long as I admit that an I am powerless(the 1st step). Being in AA for some years now and trying to practice these principles in all my affairs, I recognize my position in the world and among its people. There are not a lot things that I do have control over, I am a small piece of the puzzle. Of course, my ego wants me to think that I am powerful because that is the way things are portraited by the media, in my learning and some of my experiences. But the bottom line, when all is said and done being all powerful is not necessarily my best alternative. God is always in charge no matter what. I am powerless over alcohol,people, places and thingsha. My life is more peaceful when I am aware that I do have not be the Almighty. My role is to be the best recovering alcoholic that I can be. That means I have to attend meetings, work the steps and with other alcoholics, pray constantly, and allow GOD to be the power. I am no longer in charge. Thank GOD for a second life of recovery. I give HIM the glory.


Member: Bart
Location: Springfield
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 12:43:25 PM

Comments

It is interesting that some of us have to be told that we are powerless. Every person in the world is powerless as we are all merely the creation of God, our Father. Only God and His Son Jesus Christ have any power. We have power, if you will, only by the grace of God. It is necessary for us to align our lives with His will to share in His power. It took me some time to realize this simple fact, after I realized I was getting beaten up by alcohol. For others, it is getting beaten up by tobacco or cocaine. It doesn't matter, it's all the same. Thanks and praise be to God.


Member: the mav
Location:
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 12:47:30 PM

Comments

Dogen, again more parroted non-philosophy that others often regurgitate as you did above. Clearly I and many others never buy the false idea of it being anymore a disease than than the jaywalker-story of the little book, yet I'm sober for a long time, so why would one have to buy that idea anymore than any of the others? They don't and I am but one small example of such. You're right, it's a free land, but this AA thing promotes anything but thinking and being fully human as you just poignantly displayed with your ignorance and hypocrisy. Thanks, but no thanks pal, blame it on your "disease" if you so choose, but I know it(AA) is the biggest of all "social ills" for promoting the very idea of the "disease concept" as an absolute truth and casting judgement upon those who do not acquiesce to a condemnation of being in "denial." Oh how wrong you are and your illusory world in which AA has clearly programmed you is the ultimate blight upon anyone who does or does not have any genetic predisposistion to alcohol or not as it only serves to reinforce yours and those in AA like you's false "identity" of who those people are as individuals. That my man is the ultimate in false pride, you basically forcing your false ideals on others, whether knowingly or not. Maybe you could see the obvious by seeing the attempt at "stumpbreaking" at the coffeepot, but I doubt it. You're probably just as formed in the allegorical ideas AA has programmed in you as you displayed above to see what may be any actual absolute truth, but try if you will. Funny how AA has managed to flip things 180 degrees and turn evil into good and good into evil, huh?


Member: nevadanan
Location: nevada
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 1:48:10 PM

Comments

hi all. powerlessness is a good topic, i guess. i certainly am powerless over alcohol and drugs once i start using. as far as when i'm sober, i guess if i maintain some type of contact with my higher power he gives me the power to stay sober. in general though, power is an illusion. there is no such thing as power over anything. i have to make myself an extension of god to be powerful. anything else is false. i am very grateful today to not be in that well of powerlessness over drugs and drink. it is pretty pathetic and i still remember it vividly. so i guess i better keep on keeping on so i don;t end up back there again. these online meetings are sure different. i thank god for them since i have a 2 year old and people frown on bringing 2 year olds to meetings. especially my little trouble making angel. thanks for listening.


Member: anono
Location: today
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 2:32:18 PM

Comments

iv always read encyclopedias even as a kid and never questioned the accuracy of any information i red in it untill i looked up alcoholism and it was described as a disease''' funny how i never doubted any of the info untill it came to something that would make a diff in my life i now belive what the encyclo says an also the various medical societys


Member: robert murphy
Location: indiana ft wayne
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 2:33:35 PM

Comments

im new to all this so ill just pass on commenting if any would like to talk to me or help me any further my email address is bobbuilder63@aol.com


Member: Anne S
Location: glasgow scotland
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 3:51:12 PM

Comments

powerless...confused..scared and so very sick,thats what i always will remember about my last drink,i had a disipinary board to appear at for claiming wages that i hadnt worked and the admitting i was a thief cheat and liar who needed to drink to feel normal(i clearly wasnt). to come to aa with every intention of using the fellowship to get me out of the situation,,thank god i got"identification" from the top table,incredible support from everyone at that meeting and the feeling that maybe,just maybe these people understood what ever it was that was wrong with me, powerless is a word i dont use often now,i ask my h.p. to help me or whoever i am praying and feel better that i can ask today and i try to get on with staying alive while god helps out with the most loving power i ever felt. meant to meke this short but it gets me every time.soberiety rocks!!!!!


Member: George
Location: MN
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 5:32:35 PM

Comments

Maverick (and I suspect this is the same "Tom" of last week) who is constantly trying to disrupt this forum by bashing others and the aa steps... For someone who is blasting AA and its steps on a daily basis (and how you don't need aa), you sure do attend a lot of on line meetings. Please refer to Tradition 1, and if you don't believe in aa, consider taking your ideas elsewhere. Yes, you only need a desire to stop drinking to attend an on line meeting, but if you arenít going to follow and respect the traditions (and bluntly state it in all your comments) you may want to consider going elsewhere or starting your own organization: Tradition One: Our common welfare should come first; personal recovery depends upon AA unity. 1. Am I in my group a healing, mending, integrating person, or am I divisive? What about gossip and taking other members' inventories? 2. Am I a peacemaker? Or do I, with pious preludes such as "just for the sake of discussion," plunge into argument? 3. Am I gentle with those who rub me the wrong way, or am I abrasive? 4. Do I make competitive AA remarks, such as comparing one group with another or contrasting AA in one place with AA in another? 5. Do I put down some AA activities as if I were superior for not participating in this or that aspect of AA? 6. Am I informed about AA as a whole? Do I support, in every way I can, AA as a whole, or just the parts I understand and approve of? 7. Am I as considerate of AA members as I want them to be of me? 8. Do I spout platitudes about love while indulging in and secretly justifying behavior that bristles with hostility? 9. Do I go to enough AA meetings or read enough AA literature to really keep in touch? 10. Do I share with AA all of me, the bad and the good, accepting as well as giving the help of fellowship?


Member: Tom
Location:
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 5:38:57 PM

Comments

George,you are wrong in your assumption of Maverick being Tom.Very much the same way you are about the parroting that you just posted.


Member: George
Location: MN
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 5:48:13 PM

Comments

Sure Tom, Maverick..whatever. Maybe the two of you should get together and form your own organization based on the "truths" as you see them. You can get rid of the first step, create your own step program, and I am sure your success rate will soar. Honesty, I am hear for to listen to constructive thoughts about the steps. Not why AA is wrong and why according to Tom or Maverick, or whoever you are.


Member: George T
Location: MN
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 5:56:26 PM

Comments

P.S. The mav stated "Dogen, again more parroted non-philosophy that others often regurgitate as you did above." Tom said " Very much the same way you are about the parroting that you just posted." hmmmm. I laugh because I feel so sad for you. Sorry that was out of line, but seriously get some help.


Member: Avid one
Location:
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 6:34:59 PM

Comments

George,skip over to the pot,there ia a live 12 step procedure underway by Maverick himself.You need the help sir.Now go get yourself some help,before itis too late.


Member: Jack
Location:
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 6:36:41 PM

Comments

George,there are a lot of posters on this site that think clearly for themselves,not just Maverick and Tom.


Member: Joe B.
Location: Charleston,WV
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 7:48:51 PM

Comments

Powerlessness is the beginning of EGO deflation at depth. Im Joe and nothing more. Thank goodness


Member: Mrs. Maverick
Location: w/honey
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 10:03:51 PM

Comments

Dear Mav: There are many who use this site as a tool to stay alive, and out of institutions. The issues discussed are court approved. I am sure instead of insulting Americans you could use your intelligence to end the Arabic crisis. I am sure there are many judges and civil service officers who would be highly interested in your power and what you can do officially for them. You can even be a greater service to your self will than you already are.


Member: dave r.
Location: New Mexico
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 11:18:23 PM

Comments

Hello family, my name is dave and I'm an alcoholic. Step one tells me that the solution to all my problems is a belief, a dependence on a higher power. For me that means forgetting everything from the past and living in the now. If I read the Big Book on a daily basis...this all becomes more and more clear. Thanks for letting me share.


Member: Dogen Huxley
Location: this land is your land, this land is my land...
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 11:40:18 PM

Comments

Tom the Maverick, thanks for your comments I needed to hear that side and George of MN thank you for your support. But Tom you are still "silent" about the 2nd deadly social cancer I was talking about, so does this silence means yes you approve about what I said? I wish to give you my e-mail so that we don't have to chat but I feel that this issue is equally very important for everybody to read. I know the traditions, that AA should not engage in any controversy about other topics of religion, politics, etc. but at the same time being sober is understanding your world how it really operates to have a grip on reality.


Member: Kimberley
Location: seattle
Date: 10/12/2003
Time: 11:44:17 PM

Comments

hi kimberley here alcholic, it also says that are lives had become unmanagable, dont forget that or in my case it was unmanagble, might i say that there is a wbsite for people that post here and think this is a free for ll and not stick with the topic, its called aa reprgramming and it sound like you too might be just what they need over there. we are powerless also over people places and things, as well, you drunks know what i mean when i say that you could not stop that obsession once you took that first one it pretty much told that one that it wanted one and so on, until you were in complete oblvion, we as true alcholics are powerless over that part but we can take charge of not taking the first one, keep coming back please


Member: Tom
Location:
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 7:51:56 AM

Comments

Dogen,further debate with you is not necessary.You expect someone to take you seriously when you cant even distinguish between myself and Maverick.You jump to silly conclusion without serious thought.If anything Dogen,you are the Maverick One.That would be closer to the truth but I am not willing to go so far as to insinuate that you are indeed the Maverick One.


Member: Mike H
Location: Jackson Michigan
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 8:14:21 AM

Comments

I am powerless over AA bashers but I will not drink because of them. My life became unmanageable when I allowed alcohol to take control. Through the power and grace of my God I was able to put alcohol away for good and have been getting my life in order. I still have a long way to go but I know I will make it as long as I do a few simple things(most important of these is don't drink no matter what). Thank you all for being here. Pray for the AA bashers, they need help too.


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 9:22:59 AM

Comments

Hi, I'm Kelly and still an alcoholic. Good topic because without Step One I'd still be out there and most likely in a dirt dugout by now! Every time I read the Dr's Opinion I wish it was mandatory reading for everyone whether a drunk or not. My mom is an RN with 40 years working in hospitals and in 1960 when she graduated from nursing school they were teaching students that some people that drank too much had an allergy to alcohol. This was the beginning of AA being integrated in the medical proffesion to help Dr's understand Alcoholism. Before AA all Dr's knew to do with a drunk was send them away to dry out over and over. My personal experience with alcohol shows me that from my first drink at 13 I have been drinking alcoholically. When my Mom told me she thought I had an allergy to alcohol I did not put it together. I thought an allergy was getting the hives or puffy from a bug bite or food. An allergy in the dictionary is : An abnormal reaction to a substance. My Mom was 100 percent right! I never had a chance without understanding what happened to me when I put a drink in me. It started such a craving in me I could not stop until I was passed out. This is why I had to totally surrender to stop because even one sip started the craving all over again. A big part of Step one for me was just understanding why I reacted differently to alcohol then my teetotaling friends. I had to understand the problem to find the solution. I can never ever pick up another drink in safety. To remain sober I work at it by going to meetings, reading the BB, AND LIVING IN THE SOLUTION. This is WAY bigger than me. I will drink again and drink myself to death if I don't ask God for help everyday. Today is all I have and I can never forget that along with God being in charge, not me. I have to surrender daily to win this fight and yes, alcoholism is a fight. If I ever get so cocky as to think I have it beat I will drink again, I have no doubt about that whatsoever. Take Care All. Kelly :)


Member: Tom
Location:
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 9:54:06 AM

Comments

Mike H.,you are truly powerless over everything,everyone please pray for Mike H.


Member: maverick
Location: you're kidding right? the mav is only the mav and you'd have to be very paranoid to think otherwise....
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 12:15:23 PM

Comments

Dear Dogen, AA as an entity has no opinion on outside issues, but obviously each and every individual within AA does. I'm surprised at so thoughtful a man as yourself would not see that obvious miscontrued ideaology that is often perpetrated errently in AA about such said tradition....Just look at Kelly above, not one single thought of her own and thinks she has to think about not drinking every single second of every single day to be relieved of this silliness. How sad is that? Very in my book as I am not "cocky," only grateful that God removed the desire as the little book states and I know He doesn't just give gifts to take back. If it's given back, it's because I choose to do so, there is NO other reason. I thank God for not ever have to worry about drinking ever again just as I have not for 10x what Kelly has, so you tell me there Hogen, you tell me.... Of course people who return said gift and drink again go back to meetings, yet the millions who never drink again such as myself obviously just live life and don't ever have to go to meetings unless we choose to for whatever reason(s). Step 1--again, not particularly necessary, but sure it can be done that way if one chooses as well. The only real question is whether it is a case of take what I want or is it what I need, and leave the rest, as who is to say but myself for myself what I truly "need," as opposed to "want?" Either way, I know I don't either need or want to ever drink again and I asked God help me, which He in turn did. I do not and have not asked Him since and have not drank in quite some time and my life is extremely managable, in fact it's wonderful for the most part. Not due to not drinking, but due to loving and trusting God did what He said He'd do, once and for all....


Member: ljs
Location: il
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 12:30:06 PM

Comments

Different strokes for different folks. The Big Book clearly states that if an alcoholic can stay sober outside AA then they are to be congratulated. For me, AA works. I stay sober through the program and its steps. If this is seen by some as an indoctrination that is unacceptable to them..thats fine by me. I'll take the program..use it and stay sober.


Member: AZbill
Location: az-bill@mindspring.com
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 1:30:11 PM

Comments

HI. Bill here, alcoholic from Arizona. Step one is a start. That all it is. Just a start. I came into these room with a buddy and not believing in AA. A "cursed" old timer took me aside and told me you all could see I was sick and you were going to help me to get well. But only if I wanted to get well. I said ok. Nothing more was said. No esoterica. No Rhetoric. No prose. No secret handshake. At the end of that first meeting, my buddy came up to me with the Big Book and said he believed this thing would work. He moved in with me and we started through the steps. When I agreed that I was sick. That was a sufficient first step. When I agreed with my buddy that it just might work. That was a sufficient second step. AA was some power that might help. And when I agreed to have my buddy move to help each other get sober. That was a sufficient 3rd step. I had made a decision to give AA a shot. All three Steps in one hour. I had made a start. Thanks Love ya Bill


Member: TomP
Location: NE Iowa
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 2:46:32 PM

Comments

My name is Tom and I am an alcoholic. It really helps me when confused and argumentative about step one or any step to read it and realize it says "We" and not "I". The end of I is when I say I am an alcoholic. Everything beyond that is We and Our. So I join the first 100 alcoholics who worked the steps and become part of the fellowship of the Spirit by becoming part of the We and less and less a part of the I which was so important before finding AA.


Member: Tom
Location:
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 3:16:44 PM

Comments

Tom P. is lieing ,he is not an alcoholic,not anymore since he found us.We are all ex alcoholics cause we dont drink anymore.


Member: jay
Location: Boston
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 4:54:18 PM

Comments

I have alcoholism, not alcoholwasm. In recovery I treat my disease daily, it never goes away, a daily reprive contingent on my spiritual condition.


Member: Mark H.
Location:
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 5:25:32 PM

Comments

Jay,you do not have a disease,you just suffer from lack of better judgement,that is all.How long will you be in recovery Jay?


Member: Molly O.
Location: Washington state
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 5:57:38 PM

Comments

If I didn't believe that I was powerless I would still be drinking. My Lord and Savior has seen me through over 14yrs. of sobriety and without that higher power I would still be beating myself up with booze. I have no control over what I do without the Lords help. Molly O.


Member: Becca
Location:
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 6:12:30 PM

Comments

Molly,do you know any other miracle stories,we all have that one down pat.


Member: Becca
Location:
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 6:12:45 PM

Comments

Molly,do you know any other miracle stories,we all have that one down pat.


Member: david h
Location: nashville
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 10:43:12 PM

Comments

David real alcoholic, I am powerless over alcohol. I tried all kinds of ways to stop drinking yet, I always went back to that first one thinking this time it will be differant. Thank God for AA and the steps. they not only allow me to off the sauce but they help with the other 80% of my problem as well. As for Maverick and the rest of the research team, you are correct AA is not the only way to get off booze but it is by far the most sucessfull way. If not why are you here? If your program works so well why dont you stay on your on board? Could it be, let me see, YOUR MISERABLE! This is AA. And you more proof positive for this program. As for new comers, give this a chance you wont regret it.


Member: David
Location: Hicksville,tn
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 11:38:41 PM

Comments

Hi my name is David and I'm a real saucer.I'm on the research team when I'm not in AA.


Member: scarlett
Location: PA
Date: 10/13/2003
Time: 11:48:40 PM

Comments

i came to this site for inspiration and fellowship... what i've found tonight is a bar-room brawl. if you don't need the aa philosophy then graciously FIND SOMETHING ELSE TO DO.


Member: Jake m
Location: wa state
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 2:00:27 AM

Comments

hi, my name is Jake and when i drank, i drank in excess. i could go without, but when i chose to drink again i wouldnt quit til i was out. one way to look at it now is i wont be able to drink simply because i have to pay off the rental car i totalled. another was to look at it is i could be spending time in jail because i totalled someones life and spending more time than already served in jail. im glad i only gotta pay for the car...and obviously those fine five ohs for putting me up in the five star jail. thanks for letting me vent


Member: Tom
Location:
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 7:08:02 AM

Comments

Jake,and to think you did all that by choice.I hope you enjoy yuor accommodations.The good thing is you still have to make choices upon your checkout from the lapse of luxury hotel.So please make the right choices when you rejoin society.You really put yourself behind the eight ball financially speaking but nothing that cannot be overcome in time.Godspeed to you Jake.


Member: Dan
Location: NY
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 7:27:36 AM

Comments

I am Powerless over alcohol once I drink it. The second part of the step is that my life had become unmanagable. I'm only learning now how to THINK like a sober person. When I get out of my own way and work the program not the problems,there is Some managablity. I cannot do it alone. With the help of God and my sponsor I can be of service to others ODAAT "I Asked God for the Strength to acheive.... I was made Weak so that I learn to humbly obey" Dan


Member: Wynonna
Location:
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 7:48:36 AM

Comments

Dan be of service to yourself and be responsible and not negligent to your own well being.


Member: Gerald B.
Location: Lennox, Ca.
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 10:45:16 AM

Comments

These cyber meetings remind me of a newspaper. All kinds of sections. even comics led by Maverick nd his various names.


Member: observer
Location:
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 1:20:09 PM

Comments

Hi, new to sobriety. Am going to meetings, reading litature and trying to gain info through online discussion groups such as this. I am not pro or anti AA (YET)! lol My oberservation: This web site has more anomosity than any other site I've visited.It seems the whole alternative concept has thrown a wrench in the objective of reaching out to each other for succesful recovery ideas and support. Also, that many people following "the steps" seem truly dedicated to recovery and have tried self-will and self-recrimination and failed. The non AA's seem egotistical, angry, judgemental and closed minded. I hope that's not the only alternative. I've known several people who have abstained from alcohol for years and counting without AA and they too, seem agnry and resentful.(about life in general) It's seems to me AA is also a spritiual program on how to live sober gracefully. These are just personal oberservations of the info I've gathered so far no more, no less. Still seeking amd staying sober.


Member: not an observer
Location:
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 3:12:44 PM

Comments

some observer you are,you are as pro aa as they come


Member: still observing
Location:
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 3:42:37 PM

Comments

These are the conclustions I've come to so far. If your objective is to scare people INTO AA, keep posting. I do wish you, myself and everyone here continued sobriety no matter how achieved.


Member: jkl
Location: usa
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 5:02:34 PM

Comments

This page is by definition an AA Meeting for the World Wide Web. It makes sense that problems and experiences be discussed here within the AA framework. Folks can do battle about the pros and cons of AA but send that material to another location.


Member: day way day
Location: sane dane dane
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 5:26:23 PM

Comments

"Twice have I heard this said David: "Power belongeth unto God" Tis where we begin to tap into a government that is of a spiritual nature, one that will supply all our needs according to God's riches in Christ Jesus; It will also deliver us from our enemies those we know of and those we never suspected! Love not the world I say and you'll find the commands of God a lot easier to swallow; It's for freedom Christ has set us free, free even from the bondage of self, free to distingwish between right and wrong good and evil till we become unto a perfect man insomuch as this life will afford us. I know and am persuaded that God is able even to make a oasis in the wilderness to those who seek after nothing but his will for us in all we do..


Member: observer
Location:
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 6:11:01 PM

Comments

Re: jkl I'm sorry, I thought this was an alternative discussion forum according to the heading Discussion Meeting Alternative View and after reading the posts that preceeded mine. I truly thought this was a forum designed to discuss different views. I meant no disrespect to this site or it's purpose. Maybe I'll observe a little more and comment a little less. lol


Member: Di
Location: Midwest
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 6:40:28 PM

Comments

The importance of Step One was to admit to myself and my family that alcohol had destroyed my ability to deal with any part of my life. The magic liquid took away the need to think and feel. Problems were obliterated as soon as I was drunk. Of course once the drunk was over, self-hatred and humiliation were feelings I always had to look forward to. Even with all the chaos, admitting that my life was unmanageable was a KEY STEP to becoming sober. If I didn't, my little world of denial would eventually lead me to drink again. As for Mav and Tom, it sounds as if you have some very real anger issues. You are still living a very selfish existence, not respecting the other AA members journey to sobriety. I thought the purpose of this discussion was to help one another. Why don't you two try working through your anger and get some therapy - it would sincerely help.


Member: jkl again
Location:
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 6:48:12 PM

Comments

Any topic is a possibility on an internet board. My view is that this board exists as an AA meeting on-line. All kinds of views are expressed in meetings. There are no wrong posts just some that may more useful for folks looking for help.


Member: mav
Location: settin di-di skrait (that's ghetto talk)
Date: 10/14/2003
Time: 7:42:33 PM

Comments

How wrong you are Di, how wrong you are. First you speculate, and that's ALL it is-speculation- that I am angry, then you go on to precisely what you you state I(or we, Tom and I) did. If anyone needs real therapy (NOT the AA-chepo-group-therapy-for-a-buck either), it would seem to be you. Sure hope you're getting it girl, if not just come on over to the pot and we'll set ya up with some of billyjjr's stumpbreakin, free of charge and interactive for ya. Live from New York, it'll be the Di-sicky-chicky...


Member: Supafly
Location: Virginia
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 12:12:15 AM

Comments

Laura, alcoholic. My only problem with people online is when I can't get through their posts. So please keep it coherent and more to the point, if there is one, Maverick, Tom... whoever. In a live meeting I will usually hang out and listen and scope or laugh or whatever, or go get coffee, but here I use my ultrapowerful scroll techniqe and skip the muddled bullshit. I mean, if you wanna ignore steps or just use four of them or use a Native American Canadian rehab-provider-approach about it or whatever, cool. More power to you...but if you want other people to think about it, it ought to make sense. I have no power over alcohol to the extent that I can't control my drinking. For me that is what powerlessness means. If I had that power I would be moderately drunk constantly and life would be a marvelous thing! Until I figure out my exact drinking pace, etc. -- which from experience will never happen -- I'm better off leaving bourbon alone and dealing with everything as it is. Which ain't too bad, overall. Have a great night in da ghatto or wherever you are. :)


Member: Joe S
Location: Texas
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 1:53:32 AM

Comments

Hi: My name is Joe and I am an alcoholic and the importance of admitting the duel problem as stated in the first step is that it propels me into the other steps which are needed to live the process of recovery as suggested in the Big Book. Without the admission of the first step there would be no need for the other 11. My experiene has been to recover through the process of the steps and continue to live in recovery with them. Just as the gunshot victim can recover from a gunshot wound, by no way does this make him immune to gunshots. Similarly being recovered from alcoholism does not make me immune to alcohol. Am greatful to be a recovered member of alcoholics anonymous today.


Member: Duane P
Location: Phoenix, Az
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 3:19:21 AM

Comments

well Duane here,alcaholic. i guess i have succomb to the fact that the more power i give away to my god the more powerfull He seems to make me. that truly scares me at times because i don't want to take anything for granted like i did in my previous life or Life B.S.(Before Sober).everyday i can thank God for the blessings i have been given today and pray to make it through another day.thanks.


Member: Rust Limbo
Location: In a Moralizing Place
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 7:11:10 AM

Comments

When I was barred from entering even into the server I then realized how wrong I was and it taught me how important were the things in life that I was abusing and ignoring its essential use. I could identify with Tom Maverick, I know he is a Jew and Jews have withstand the trials of prejudice and descrimination for hundreds of years in Christian Europe, and even in America that's why they have to excel to survive in very harsh conditions. They have to believe in themselves despite all the odds, in that way its the faith that will pull them through and bring them to ingenuity. It's different in how Christians see the world since ever since the Holy Roman Empire the whole Western Civilization was rule by Christians so the frame of mind is to obey the Powers that Be (as AA have been founded by White Protestants). But the Jews have to fight themselves against this Powers that be to retain their identity and for their own survival. That's how I ended up being so angry and critical and bitter, is when you see life on life's terms while others give you these terms and put you in a spot and you cannot helped but be powerless over people and situations that oppresses you. And one of the way out is alcohol, because it empowers you, it makes you feel powerful. Even now that I'm sober I still think like that but then my ife has become more unmanageable. I see life as a mystery not as a problem to be solved the more I learn through experience the more I confess I don't understand. It's easy to say I work for it, when you are a success, but it's not easy to say you work for it when things turn around you like those self-righteous people high up on the pedestal when they were caught with their pants down. Do you stil hear them be so sure and moralizing after that? NO.And all of those things that you eagerly righteously agreed with him became false all along. But it's not too late for me to think straight and maturely on oppurtunities like this one, a gift to make something of good use out of it and to learn how.


Member: Mav
Location:
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 8:16:31 AM

Comments

Duane P. has been reincarnated.He keeps giving it away only to find out that he still has it.Minds games can be deceptive,eh oh boy


Member: Di
Location: Midwest
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 8:31:00 AM

Comments

Dear Mav -Looking back at my comments, it did appear that I was anger at you! Sorry. And I really didn't want to come off that way. Just felt that it would be more productive to think in terms of how this program is helping and working rather than what you don't believe in. By the way, I am in therapy to work out my issues. Goal is to help others become sober.


Member: observing
Location:
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 8:36:13 AM

Comments

The Mav has stumpbroke Di and he was not even trying.The Mav works in miraculous ways.


Member: observing
Location:
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 9:40:45 AM

Comments

that was not me commenting....yikes that guy's a creep!! Going to a new web site. Good luck on everyone's sobriety.


Member: Dale W
Location: W.Y.
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 9:48:58 AM

Comments

Hi, I'm Dale an alcoholic! Why do we say that? my opinon is to take the first step. As the big book says. (which isn't used enough in this meeting) No person likes to think he is bodily and mentally different from his fellows.Therefore, it is not surprising that our drinking careers have been characterized by countless vain attempts to prove we could drink like other people. The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy hi drinking is the great obsession of every abnormal drinker. The persistence of thiks illusion is astonishing. Many pursue it into the gates of insanity or death. WE LEARNED THAT WE HAD TO FULLY CONCEDE TO OUR INNERMOST SELVES THAT WE WERE ALCOHOLICS. THIS IS THE FIRST STEP IN RECOVERY. In A.A. we look for the similarities not the differences. If I were different I probably would still be drinking. and when I woke up this morning I wasn't thirsty. I believe that anyone who has a problem with or without alcohol has taken the first step otherwise they would'nt seek help. So the spiritual principal applied to the first step is honesty. Honesty with myself I know for years other people have told me I had a problem with alcohol, but I wasn't honest I was different. Today when I say I'm an alcoholic I'm being honest with myself, and I can see where my life had become unmanagable by my use of alcohol. The paradox of this is when I go through the steps and reach step 12 does my H.P. gives me some power back. So give youself a chance and follow the suggestions in the first 164 pgs. because they are presise directions to show how we have recovered (ed) not (ing). I was shown very early that personal opinons can kill, so be careful. As for myself if it don't come out of the B.B. I can call bullshit and don't have to do it. Thanks.


Member: Susan A.
Location: Vernon, Connecticut
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 10:52:34 AM

Comments

Hi All, I'm Susan and I'm an Alcoholic. //1// 'Power' just means the capacity or ability to do or accomplish something. 'Powerless' means not having that ability. On my own, I didn't have (or really want) the ability to stop drinking AND STAY STOPPED through whatever life threw at me. At first through the people staying sober in rooms of AA, then directly, God gave me the power/ability to not drink and the belief that, if I kept certain principles, I wouldn't have to go back to drinking to live my own life however it unfolds. This 'letting go (admitting I don't have the power/ability)' and 'letting God (getting the power/ability from whatever you call God)' and 'taking action' works for anything. It's a formula that's been working well for me for quite a while now, and I'm grateful. //2// I found out yesterday my friend of 5 years Kathy died unexpectedly Monday. This hurts alot, and I'm very sad. She died sober, and very happy with her friends, her rebuilt family and the support she found through the program and the fellowship of AA and her God. She didn't waste any time analyzing and arguing about bull shit semantics and opinions, like what's going on in this meeting this week. She utilized what fit for her and went about helping others. I'm glad she was my friend, and I'll miss her. //3// Well, as for most of the meeting this week, I can tell that trying to shove opinions down other's throats is just as ugly and works just as well as when you were pontificating in the bar rooms. Sheesh, give it a rest, boys. Oh, and Mav/Tom/no name (no guts?)/whoever, don't bother enlightening me/the rest of the world with your 'educated' (!) response - save your editorials for someone else (preferably on a different site, thank you). I really don't give a rat's ass what you think. My feelings and actions used to be influenced by negative judgemental head-jobs like yourselves; luckily, today God helps me understand you're sick and I deserve better than your company. Yes, that's an 'opinion', and like you and your asshole, I've got 'em, too. Via con Dios. //4// Thank, All, who are trying to help others here. See you next week.


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 11:09:04 AM

Comments

Thanks ((Dale)), Great post! We do not talk enough about the Big Book which is how some of us got and stay sober. If we don't stand up for our beliefs then what exactly do we have for sobriety? I don't ever want to get lukewarm about staying sober. I learned about the (Sick/ Angry Mans Prayer) a couple weeks ago studying Step 4. I was told to keep it my purse and to recite it when needed. You know it works, at least for me... >>> We realized that the people who wronged us were perhaps spiritually sick. Though we did not like their symptoms and the way these disturbed us, they like ourselves, were sick too. We asked God to help us show them the same tolerance, pity and patience that we would cheerfully grant a sick friend. When a person offended we said to ourselves, "This is a sick man. How can I be helpful to him? God save me from being angry. Thy will be done." >>> End quote. BB pg. 66-67. You know I can really see the AA program at work here, especially when we admitted our wrongs honestly and were willing to set them right on this board. I applaud you all that do that because that is keeping our side of the street clean as they say. Well, Thats all I wanted to say. Lets all align our will with Gods today and see what happens! Kelly :)


Member: Mia B.
Location:
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 12:49:15 PM

Comments

I really just need to vent a little in an A.A. format. I have about 9 months sober and lately have been very confused and stuck on doing the right thing. I have been in self-will a lot but also confused about what to deem self will and what not to. I have talked to my counselors, my friends, and my sponsor about it and still have this swell of anxiety,fear,and pain moving around in me. I got involved with someone who was relatively new in sobriety about 3 months ago, and due to rules of treatment had to maintain boundaries during the first 2 and a half months, the boundaries were broken and i made amends where necessary. We have gotten very close over the last few months specifically and i care so much for them and love them and want the best for them. I graduated from my inpatient and we spent the weekend together. On sunday her mother called and had found out about us and went completely ballistic and put her on house arrest. All this drama came out and her parents took her out of the outpatient program. Now she does not have that support system in recovery that is instilled in her daily life. I fell so much shame over it but i love her and don't know what to do. Her parents say that on the slim chance that she can come back to the outpatient that we can not contact each other outside of those rooms. I feel so stuck and shameful right now. I told her i would be there for her no matter what and that i want the best and the right thing. I feel so crazy right now my thinking is so fearful and fast. I have only rambled a little bit so the story is pretty crazy, basically her dad doesnt care if we are together but her mother and stepfather have banned me from her and my outpatient counselors i think are disappointed in my choices. Please if anyone has feedback post it or email me at Miab122@hotmail.com


Member: Sam
Location: Midwest
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 12:55:19 PM

Comments

This discussion is truly sad. This is my first and last visit. I have never seen so much hatred in a place intended to be a haven. If you don't believe in AA, leave. If you don't need AA to stay sober, leave. AA works for millions of people. AA is for the newcomer most importantly. There is no good that can come of "disproving" its validity. You can spout any venom back at me that you want, I will not be here to read it. I suggest to those that want serenity and sobriety to find something else, cause this isn't it. God Bless You All


Member: BYE SAM
Location:
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 1:30:54 PM

Comments

Sam,thanks for taking your own advice of not believing in AA and leaving.If you truly believed you would still be here.There is no such thing as a safe haven,the closest thing would be a jail cell where you can not do much wrong.


Member:
Location:
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 4:31:07 PM

Comments

nice susan, really nice, thanks....


Member:
Location:
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 4:31:33 PM

Comments

in case you don't know---that's called sarcasm


Member:
Location:
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 4:32:31 PM

Comments

but susygirl, ya gotted one thing right-nobody gives a damn what you and your asshole think....


Member: Mike M
Location: MA, USA
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 6:08:15 PM

Comments

Admitting I was powerless over alcohol made sense after I picked up the first drink after a month and a half of sobriety. That clinched it. I did not have a defense against the first drink as the founders of AA learned. Knowledge and willpower by themselves can not work for an alcoholic of my type (hopeless) the concluding part of step 1, - that our lives had become unmanageable was now understood. I have a fatal mental obsession for alcohol and a uncontrolable physical craving for it after the first drink. What remained was to attempt the steps of recovery in earnest and it has worked! (getting off the sauce again first). I will say I agree with some of the posts about the powers we do have. I can't remember where I read this but it is true for me and many AA members I know. We have the power of example and the power of suggestion. AA works!


Member: d. nicole shandley
Location:
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 6:24:49 PM

Comments

well this has been a very intresting meeting, due to so many diffrent opionins. i am new to sobriety, but have in and out of aa for 3 years. i know for a fact that i am powerless over my disease, and that i do need a higher power to keep me sober, sain,and emotionally balanced. wich i am working on in due time.just because were staying sober doesnt mean that we have no character deflaws! so keep that in mind. and pray for all who are still sick in the head.


Member: Robert T
Location: Beaverton Or
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 8:56:45 PM

Comments

I am trying to get back into AA again and need alot of support. I believe I have alot to offer and with the help of all of you and and a wonderful God in my life maybe I got another chance. Thanks


Member: The Exorcist
Location:
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 9:13:00 PM

Comments

I know that there are people here who are serving the devil I know that they know who I am and what I said here, they are really good in giving me a hard time because I am their enemy for they knew I am God's and they are of the evil ones. And then they would like to make it sound like sarcastic and then to let me think that I'm paranoid. Hypocrites. Yeah I'm powerless over these people who has ingrained in their genetic core to put down people to be happy.I know you are serving the Devil, the 666! By the name of St. Michael the Archangel You sons of Devils shall be banished to the deepest part of hell after you will die! By the Blood of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ You demons shall go to hell and will be there forever! You are happy now in torturing poor men's souls but when you die you know you belong to Satan and his angels in hell! So rejoice while there is still time for you because the payback is waiting!Aba-shali-shabla- gudi- frichdi-ti-politrdi- tickr!


Member: We are so scared
Location:
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 9:57:06 PM

Comments

The Exorcist,go douse yourself with your holt water and feel yourself burn to the ground,you idiot.


Member: Mike Q
Location: Lousville,KY.
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 10:42:58 PM

Comments

I thank God for the first step. For me steps 1,2 and 3 are the building blocks of a strong foundation. Through admittance and acceptance, I start the journey towards freedom from the bondage of self. The Big Book say's that one must concede to one's innermost self that he/she has this disease, that is the true first step!


Member: Mike Q
Location: Lousville,KY.
Date: 10/15/2003
Time: 10:43:17 PM

Comments

I thank God for the first step. For me steps 1,2 and 3 are the building blocks of a strong foundation. Through admittance and acceptance, I start the journey towards freedom from the bondage of self. The Big Book say's that one must concede to one's innermost self that he/she has this disease, that is the true first step!


Member: Terry
Location: uk
Date: 10/16/2003
Time: 9:29:34 AM

Comments

Am I powerless over alcohol? Well I was eleven years ago, the last time I drank any. Am I powerless today? No because I don't drink. My life is not unmanageable today, sometimes hard but never unmanageable. I am happy, content, and continuing to grow both personally and spiritually.I no longer attend meetings because I was fed up with people telling me I was suffering from an Illness and not only that but telling me that I didn't feel ill because my illness was telling me I didn't have it. Well you can't argue that position with any measure that I am aware of, so I took my recovery and got on with my life. before you comment, remember that I am here to freely give what was given to me.


Member: jk
Location: usa
Date: 10/16/2003
Time: 11:13:44 AM

Comments

Robert T: Call AA. You'll find a number in your phone book. Get to a meeting ASAP. This board has an interesting mix of opinions but it is absolutely no substitute for the real thing. Go, now.


Member: HUH
Location:
Date: 10/16/2003
Time: 6:25:58 PM

Comments

Robert,better yet,call AAA.


Member: david d
Location: so. il.
Date: 10/16/2003
Time: 10:28:49 PM

Comments

reading this stuff has helped me in my f2f meetings.. cause it helps me be more tolerant of others even if they are crying out in pain i have severe problems with anger/resentment and fear and by grace iv learned that its the same as alcohol i cant wish it away ,,,it even says so on pg. 66 of my beloved big book and i thank hp for the wisdom in that book


Member: E.C.III
Location: P.a
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 1:49:07 AM

Comments

Hello! My tag is E.C.III and I am an ALCAHOLIC! I may not be a very good speller, but Im serious about what I say!...I completly agree with what scarlett had to say! I take my sobriety very serious it means Life or Death to Me! I dont think this is an Argumentive, Playing, or Fooling around SUBJECT or PAGE for that Matter! And if YOU are an ALCAHOLIC,- Maverick--Tom--or WHOMEVER! Why dont you try and remember where YOU used to be OR STILL ARE! Remember how you felt? Remember the PAIN!!!?! How do you think A newcomer FEELS?!! OR what they THINK?!!When they come on this site LOOKING FOR HELP/GUIDANCE and they see that kind of BULL$#!^ !!! Its just not Fair! THE NEWCOMER IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PERSON!!!!!!!!! Where is your SPIRITUALITY????? WHY USE THIS SITE FOR YOUR OWN SELFISH DISIRES??? Please take it somewhere els! PLEASE!! -- The book says-The fact is that Most alcaholics,for reasons yet obscure,have Lost the Power of Choice in Drink. Our so called Will Power becomes practically Nonexistent. Weare unable, at certain times, to bring into our consciousness with sufficient force the memory of the Suffering and Humiliation of even a week or month ago. WE ARE WITHOUT DEFENSE AGAINST THE FIRST DRINK!!!!!!!!!! I have hit bottom many of times, and built my self back up many of times... Only to fall right back in again sometimes Deeper! But I finally stoped digging that hole and sought help, because I new I could not do it alone!!! I WAS, AND STILL AM, AND WILL ALWAYS BE, POWERLESS OVER THIS DISESE OF ALCAHOLISM!!!!!!!!! I used to think I could not live without it, And through this Fellowship the LOVE,HELP,and UNDERSTANDING- I found out that I could NOT LIVE,AND PROBABLY WOULD NOT LIVE WITH IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sure I will always have thoughts about it?!! But with my HIGHER POWER, and the GREATE PEOPLE in the A.A.Fellowship...TODAY I DONT have to Fight IT ALONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!P.S. THANK YOU!


Member: IC
Location:
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 3:22:21 AM

Comments

Again, the insanity of the first drink can and does occur for the positive reason of experiencing a feeling of euphoria as often as it occurs from the stress of emotional pain. This is a critical difference between the alcoholic and the non-alcoholic and the hardest concept for the non-alcoholic public to understand. POWERLESSNESS: Definition: [n] the quality of lacking strength or power; being weak and feeble Synonyms: impotence, impotency Antonyms: power, powerfulness See Also: helplessness, impuissance, ineffectiveness, ineffectuality, ineffectualness, quality, uninterestingness, unpersuasiveness, weakness


Member: Karol R.
Location: fairfax, VA
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 3:58:06 AM

Comments

I am powerless over alcohol. I know that all it would take would be one drink and I would be drunk all over again. I have to keep from that first drink. By working the steps and by the grace of my higher power I can keep from that first drink. I just celebrated my 10 year anniversary on september 25th 2003 and it feels good. But I know that once an alcoholic always an alcoholic and I have to stay in the program to stay sober.


Member: Karol R.
Location: fairfax, VA
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 4:00:30 AM

Comments

I am powerless over alcohol. I know that all it would take would be one drink and I would be drunk all over again. I have to keep from that first drink. By working the steps and by the grace of my higher power I can keep from that first drink. I just celebrated my 10 year anniversary on september 25th 2003 and it feels good. But I know that once an alcoholic always an alcoholic and I have to stay in the program to stay sober.


Member: NW
Location: WA
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 4:26:24 AM

Comments

Powerless is a scary term, yet needs to be used when something can and in my case has controlled my life, but until you decide to deal with it and understand it, you aren't getting anywhere. One of the hardest things for me to understand was that I was powerless over my addiction, I didin't think something of that sort would have taken over my life, but it sure did. I agree, with self-confidence and using the 12 step program has helped alot.


Member: Scott M
Location: Ohio
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 5:10:27 AM

Comments

Scott..Alcoholic. The one thing I've found in regards to being Powerless is this... The only power I have comes from far beyond. The only power I have is to accept that I am powerless. Thanks. 13 days and counting


Member: You know me
Location: You know exactly where I'm at
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 5:52:50 AM

Comments

AA taught me that I'm powerless over a disease called alcoholism. An obession of the mind and a spiritual malady and I have to admit that my life has become unmanageable. After taking the first step, AA teaches me that I'm also powerless over people, places and situations, which I still have a hard time surrending that to the Powers that be. But after more than a decade of being dry I am now slowly trying to realize and learn to let go of things that I cannot change. Life is a battle called survival. And I need to win this game by losing by letting go, by swallowing my pride and develop my inner strength. I am homeless and unemployed, different from the normal people, I always get picked on by the predators and the cliques of society. But I have to accept that I have destroyed not only my mind but also my behaviour that I've learned through all those drinking years of my growing up and that I have done a lot of things which are coming around at the present. My Mr. Hyde still surfaces and want to assert my down trodden pride and seeks compensation for it in other destructive behaviours and thinking that I used to carry around when I was still drinking. Most often he dominates my life because of the oppression that I have made myself into, but like any day a new dawn comes and my Dr. Jekyll tries to pacify and work things out so that I could still function and go on, despite the burden I made of myself because of my other split personality that the big Book also used to described it. Plus the fact that my committee of psychic frequencies is also very active in calling me to my consience and grounding me to the painful reality of ego deflation. From this Inner World it also reflects the Outer World of how I relate myself to people and their treatment of me. Like a baby I have to learn to trudge the road of happy destiny which is how to live in the present. I know adversities makes a stronger person out of me, but some leave its mark and that I have to accept it and live with it for the rest of my life. I know I'm a loser in the eyes of many, that people used against me to exercise their power and authority, this too I have to come to terms with my Mr. Hyde so that my goal is for this two split personalities of mine reconciles and will make me whole again. I know people will say that I'm just afraid, I'm a wimp that gives and caves in right away like a spineless coward because I don't have any pride to start with, but that is my lot. And even if people will look at me with dismay like seeing Job from the bible lose all I have to stand firm on my ground even if like Job, I have to wallow on my mire and wait for my Higher Power on its own time.


Member: common sense
Location:
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 7:40:32 AM

Comments

If one is powerless over alcohol,then who decides to actually give it up for you.If it is the person who is powerless giving it up then it means that if you do actually give it up then you indeed have power over the alcohol.You have power after all.


Member: Robert T
Location: Beaverton or
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 10:02:05 AM

Comments

I appreciate the insight.I have been to 3 meetings this week and feel better already for all you message board geniuses. The guy that told me to call AAA, I appreciate your humor, there is always a guy or gal like you on message boards. Thanks again, Robert


Member: Lack of....
Location: sense about alcohol!
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 10:07:50 AM

Comments

You don't have power over alcohol because you stop. You surrender to it. How long can you hold your breath before you have to surrender to the urge and take another breath? Why does a parent that can't swim jump in to save their drowning child knowing they will drown themselves? Why does an alki have to drink themselves almost to death many times over before stopping drinking? It isn't stopping... it's beyond us. It's about surrendering to something bigger than ourselves. There are very few things I know I do on a daily basis that would kill me other than drink. I do have control over "those" things. I don't get up and set myself on fire, I don't go without eating for weeks on end, I don't jump off of tall buildings because that would kill me. BUT I would get intoxicated every day and get behind the wheel of a car, have unsafe sex while intoxicated, Do all kinds of unsafe things while blacked out I did not even remember doing. Any normal person would just stop drinking but I could not because I'm an alcoholic. I did not want to die at all but I could not stop trying to kill myself by the bottle. This is the point your missing entirely. Your obviously not a "real" alcoholic. If you were you would not say the stupid and untrue crap you spew. Just go out and drink responsibly or not at all because you can and leave the alcoholism to us that can't. I'm really getting tired of being told to "just not drink" by a non-alki with an attitude problem...Sheeze, At least in face to face AA people understand me.


Member: Robert T
Location: Beaverton or
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 10:20:11 AM

Comments

I appreciate the insight.I have been to 3 meetings this week and feel better already for all you message board geniuses. The guy that told me to call AAA, I appreciate your humor, there is always a guy or gal like you on message boards. Thanks again, Robert


Member: huh
Location:
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 11:00:05 AM

Comments

Robert,calling AAA was not neant to be humorous,you will get better results,you will see.


Member: Lisa
Location: FL
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 1:08:20 PM

Comments

Hi, I just recently admitted to myself that I am powerless over alcohol. I finally got myself into a meeting. Admitting I am powerless was the hardest thing I have ever done in my life. Fully accepting that I am is the hardest part but I have been fighting that for a few years now and I am tired. I want to live, I don't want to be dead inside anymore. I guess I have accepted it, although a part of me doesn't want to. How can we be powerless over a drink. Its crazy, but it has broken me down to almost nothing so many times and this last time I finally asked God to help me, to come to me and thats when I had an overwhelming feeling to go to a meeting and this time actually go inside. I guess its obvious I am powerless over alcohol. Reading what I am writting is so hard, is this me. Is this my life. I just keep telling myself that I won't drink today and hopefully in a few months of sobriety this won't seem so bad. I am getting a lot of hope from the encouraging words I am seeing on this site of people who are making it. My prayers are with each of you


Member: Sarah T.
Location: NYC
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 2:29:18 PM

Comments

Well if Robert thought the comment about calling AAA, not AA, was funny, then it was! (If you didn't mean it to be funny you should have done a better job expressing your sarcasm!) I thought it was very funny too! Good luck, Robert and everyone who is early in sobriety especially. Although you really do NOT need "luck," you just need to go to meetings and not drink -- it is *very* simple!


Member: Mike C.
Location: Denver
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 2:57:25 PM

Comments

Hi everyone. My name is Mike and I am an alcoholic. Wow. Can't imagine life with alcohol, or without it. I remember that POWERLESS feeling. What a dilemma. Thankfully, all I had to do was pickup the simple kit of spiritual tools laid at my feet. Here's an excerpt from a letter written by Bill W. "A Fragment of History" I found on the Grapevine website. ____________ When he arrived in New York in the late fall of 1934, Ebbie thought at once of me. On a bleak November day he rang up. Soon he was looking at me across our kitchen table at 182 Clinton Street, Brooklyn, New York. As I remember that conversation, he constantly used phrases like these: "I found I couldn't run my own life;" "I had to get honest with myself and somebody else;" "I had to make restitution for the damage I had done;" "I had to pray to God for guidance and strength, even though I wasn't sure there was any God;" "And after I'd tried hard to do these things I found that my craving for alcohol left." Then over and over Ebbie would say something like this: "Bill, it isn't a bit like being on the water wagon. You don't fight the desire to drink -- you get released from it. I never had such a feeling before." ____________ God's grace is an awesome thing. But faith needs action. How much feedom do you want. I've heard it said that what is expressed here is only the OPINION of the speaker. And, if it cannot be reconciled with the book Alcoholics Anonymous it should probably be disregarded. So with that said, please spare me your intellectual bullshit!! My experience has been that the God of Intellect was of no use to me when dealing with a spiritual malady. Everybody have a great day and remember to BE HELPFUL! Mike


Member: LMAO at all the powerlessness
Location: or really lack of brains
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 4:43:57 PM

Comments

Just stop drinking,it is that simple,attending meetings are optional and a lot of people go to them because they dont have a cover charge and even some that are really bored and dont have anything else to do.


Member: Blanche M
Location:
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 5:28:56 PM

Comments

I agree with Maverick about the powerlessness being a cop-out. Everyone needs to take responsibility for their own choices and problems. Alcoholism is not a disease it is a lack of self-control and a weakness that you have a choice to make. Diseases are caused by physical malfunctions. A weakness for drugs or alcohol or any other addiction is a mental weakness/choice. As LMAO says. AA meetings are nothing more than a lonely hearts club and they make me want to throw-up. People!! Get a grip and grow up. Stop all of the pontificating and terrible grammar and spelling!


Member: lkh
Location: usa
Date: 10/17/2003
Time: 6:50:50 PM

Comments

Robert: Congratulations! You've taken the first big steps toward a new life without alcohol. Keep it up. Get to know AA people. Find a sponsor. Remember, this board contains a variety of opinions. You've found what works for you. Stay with it.


Member: J.B.
Location: in AA
Date: 10/18/2003
Time: 12:27:26 AM

Comments

Here we go playing doctor. Alcoholism is the disease. Alcohol abuse is not. Lots of people is AA who are not alcoholic.


Member: Jeff M
Location:
Date: 10/18/2003
Time: 10:13:54 AM

Comments

Jeff M here, a true alcoholic. As AA is part of pop culture, everyone is familiar with the phrase "in denial." Ironically, that phrase itself was an obstacle to my finally grasping my powerlessness over alcohol. I wasn't denying anything. I saw myself in the mirror every morning, hung over from the night before, wondering if I'd make it to work again, and knew I was a drunk. There was no denial. But I took great pains to accomodate my drinking, thinking that I could have the best of both worlds, i.e., being a drunk, and getting by in society. I would never drive while drunk, I would avoid phone calls so I wouldn't have to slur my words (unless I was so drunk that I'd answer the phone anyway thinking I could speak clearly while in reality I was embarrassing myself and losing yet another person's respect), I would guzzle alka-seltzer and medicine in the morning so I wouldn't feel so god-awful at work. Then I started avoiding my kids in the evening, preferring to pass out on the couch EVERY NIGHT. I thought this was good because at least they wouldn't have to see me drunk (huh?). I needed to hear the message in a different way than the usual phrase about "denial." Then I read somewhere that the turning point for some alcoholics was when they finally became "convinced" that they were powerless. THAT hit me. I don't know why, but I "got it" on those terms. There was all the evidence that I was living a rotten, wretched life, yet for years I was still not convinced that THIS lifestyle, the way I was living, was killing me (literally, physically killing me) and hurting those around me. I give up, I'm convinced. What made my stupidity particularly offensive is that I had so many advantages in life; I had gifts and opportunities that a better person could have turned into a life of greatness by any standard. Yet here I was in the prime of my life, pissing it all away. We are alive for such a short time, and I wasted most of my time. My kids are growing up. I swear I thought that going through life in a coma was acceptable in some twisted way. Now I know first hand what being "in denial" means.


Member: Joe B.
Location: Charleston, WV
Date: 10/18/2003
Time: 10:56:46 AM

Comments

its Sat. Morn and my chimney sweep just blew his top about conditions agreed to by someone else. we finally solved the problem by negociation. something i need lots of practice at. cheers


Member: wow
Location: to Jeff M
Date: 10/18/2003
Time: 11:02:33 AM

Comments

Thank you...that was exactly what I needed to hear this morning. It is amazing to me to find myself in other's stories. Although this internet variety of carrying the message has some draw backs, I still find it a great source of inspiration.


Member: Deborah B.
Location: Indiana
Date: 10/18/2003
Time: 1:37:48 PM

Comments

Step One, in my opinion, was one of the hardest for me. I am a person with a lot of self-will and for me to admit I am powerless---well that is something I really had to work on. I also have to KEEP ON working this step everyday. It reminds me that my HP is in charge and NOT me.


Member: Deborah B.
Location: Indiana
Date: 10/18/2003
Time: 2:05:19 PM

Comments

By the way, I see that some people seem to think that they have the liberty to take other people's inventories on this site. Why is it that nonalcoholics just do not get it? Why are they even here in the first place? Probably because they have such low self-esteem that they think they can be so big and brave and anonymous that they take pot-shots at people who have the courage to admit they need help. What's the matter? Don't have the courage to admit you need help? If you think you are so much better than us "dumb, weak alcoholics", then why are you here in the first place? What's the matter? The truth hurts, or what?


Member: Chris H.
Location: Fla.
Date: 10/18/2003
Time: 4:31:51 PM

Comments

I'm Chris--I'm an alcoholic/addict..I am powerless oever alcohol-my various other addictions & as my sponsor says , people, places and things...I think the people, places and things has been the hardest for me to accept. In my extremly disfunctional family of origin, we were taught that we were very much in control of what one other person , the abuser of the family, did. It is hard for me to "deprogram" from that mindset. Of course, we we actually had NO power over him at all. But we sure tried...Now that I have much more understanding about NOT being able to change ANYONE, my life is much more serene...I have learned in the rooms that my only true responsibility is myself...and that if I keep my side of the street clean...if I take care of what I am responsible for, then I can leave the rest to my Higher Power, who I call God. He is the ONLY one that can truly change anyone or anything...MY life had become unmanagable and still becomes that way from time to time...The difference is that now, when I see the signs of that happening, I know that I have let my program slide. Now, atleast, I know what to do,and for that I am very greatful.


Member: jill h
Location: ny
Date: 10/18/2003
Time: 9:24:15 PM

Comments

for GODS sake let all the brainy acts who seem to know about stopping starting and staying stopped stay on the computer I prefer live conversations with real people who if I could see you and not just read your words I'd have a better idea of who I am really giving my open mind to, also 15 yrs sober makes me nothing other than living a decent moral life today and yes blanche i agree its a choice today it wasn't way back when it took time to see the reason for stopping and looking up to the sky for help god the father and son so I'll go to meetings you go to the computer and we will all live happily ever after maybe even help someone along the way, what a concept.


Member: glad to be here
Location:
Date: 10/18/2003
Time: 11:22:04 PM

Comments

...You must see the irony in Blanche's (Dubois I presume) statement. She has an extremley active social life and yet spends her much sought after time, going on the internet, looking up websites that serve her no purpose, reads the endless posts and then tells them THEY are lonely. All the while her phone is ringing off the hook. Also, to further her feelings of grandiose, she mentally edits the posts with disgust because she is (for now) incapable of opening her heart and mind to the spirit of another human being. I personally wish her to find 1/10 of the fellowship we find with each other. May I suggest a site for people anal about the English language.