Member: Solvie A.
Location: Suffolk County
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 7:10:05 AM

Comments

Solvie here, I'm an alcoholic. I feel a little strange being the first again this week. I guess I'm an early riser and my home group doesn't have a meeting on Sundays (I usually go to a 6:15am reflection meeting other days, but the church isn't available on Sundays). Soooo, I guess what I would like to discuss is the eleventh step, because that is what has been most present in my life of all the steps for a very long time. Spirituality has been the most important thing for me. I do yoga and meditate as part of my spiritual practice. I also use Tarot. Some of the most meaningful times for me have been to go on week long meditation retreats. I have always felt the H.P. working in my life. But that is part of the reason I had a hard time admitting I was an alcoholic!! I thought I was doing all the right things spiritually, so how could drinking be an issue!? I felt I had an open ear always, so if I drank a little too much, well.... I still believe there are no mistakes, and where are path leads us is always ultimately the right place. So, I wonder how and if I could have gotten to this place earlier. Somehow, my little mind took over, and masqueraded as the greater voice of my higher power. That is why AA is so magical and wonderful, because our daily attendance keeps us on the right path. And in some ways I also think we are extremely lucky to have these guiding principles and something so deep (even if painful) which connects us. Blessings to all, and have a great week.


Member: Melissa M
Location: Nebraska
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 7:27:36 AM

Comments

Hi. Melissa, alcoholic here. I work the overnight shift, so am usually up this early! Anyway, the 11th step...vital to my staying sane. What I have to remember is to pray ONLY for knowledge of His will for me, and the power to carry that out. I get carried away sometimes, and forget what the simple instructions are! Having that connection with my HP is a must for me, and not only on a daily basis, but in a situation by situation basis...every aspect of my life demands that I use my HP's guidence...if I do it alone, my life is a mess...I may not drink...but the alcoholic thinking just gets completely out of control, and with that, I am setting myself up to drink. I am not willing to do that today. Anyway, after having been up all night, my brain is ready for a rest. I just needed some AA stuff this morning, and I thank you for being here, and letting me share.


Member: robm
Location: california-currently in Bombay India
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 7:36:42 AM

Comments


Member: robm
Location: californian-currently in Bombay India
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 7:41:41 AM

Comments

The 11th step is, for me the cornerstone of my current program, it is the way that I really know how well I am doing. My life has ups and downs, good things and bad, but it is how well I am connected to my HP that really provides me with the test of how well I am managing things (as opposed to what stuff I happen to be dealing with right now). My life here has a lot of stress, and meditation has been extremely difficult. I just feel so "mentally agitated" that it's hard. I know that this too will pass and that I just need to make my self available for my HP to speak to me. I am so grateful for my sobriety and my HP's guidance. My life is so full of blessings that I cannot even begin to keep track of them all. I get off track when I get greedy and decide that it is time for me to have more (usually what I want most is more security and guarantees).


Member: Kelly M
Location: Rome
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 8:24:41 AM

Comments

Hi ((Solvie00, Step 11 is my favorite reading Step. I'm not there yet but from attending 12 and 12 meetings it is in the 12 and 12 book which I loaned to a friend. It says in there somewhere: I never prayed rightly and I had this illusion of being connected and having something like a spiritual awakening at times, totally paraphrasing here! I felt I had a direct line to God most of my life. I of course did not because my prayer was selfish other than praying for my family and deceased relatives. So I never got the ~Grace~ I have now or the ~Peace~. I was on a power trip before and this Serenity I have now is not in spurts of religious frenzy but has lasted since my last drink when I totally surrendered. Pretty powerful stuff! I went to Church all my life and I just learned how to pray rightly? Last night driving a friend home a song came on the radio by Joan Osborn, "What If God Was One Of Us". Well, we both started singing along and it hit me that I always loved that song but I hear it different now. Before I just heard the 2nd stanza of the song, the catchy part but now I heard the 1st and 3rd. Before I was caught up in the emotional spiritualism of the song and missing the message. The part about the Pope made me cringe because it does not belong there, before I found it funny. I don't know why but it is like since I stopped trying to play masterette of the universe from a barstool I can see the egotistical self centeredness of my past spirituality. I am actually humble enough to admit that today...;) Well for anybody interested in the lyrics of this catchy song here they are: >>> If God had a name, what would it be And would you call it to His face If you were faced with Him in all His glory What would you ask if you had just one question>>> Yeah, yeah, God is great Yeah, yeah, God is good Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah What if God was one of us Just a slob like one of us Just a stranger on the bus Trying to make His way home If God had a face, what would it look like And would you want to see If seeing meant that you would have to believe In things like Heaven and in Jesus and the Saints And all the Prophets and... Yeah, yeah, God is great Yeah, yeah, God is good Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah What if God was one of us Just a slob like one of us Just a stranger on the bus Trying to make His way home Tryin' to make His way home Back up to Heaven all alone Nobody callin' on the phone 'Cept for the Pope maybe in Rome Yeah, yeah, God is great Yeah, yeah, God is good Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah What if God was one of us Just a slob like one of us Just a stranger on the bus Trying to make His way home Just tryin' to make his way home Like a holy rolling stone Back up to Heaven all alone Just tryin' to make his way home Nobody callin' on the phone 'Cept for the Pope maybe in Rome >>>> Believe me it is much better with sound attached! Lol... That's it from the peanut gallery for this week. Kelly :)


Member: mike
Location: mount forest,ont canada
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 9:59:17 AM

Comments

Hi, This is my seconded time and I now know that I was not doing step 11 . I would let things bug me to a point where it was I did know if I was coming or going. I was told to pray to my HP to take the things that are bugging me and to deal with them.


Member: Kathy F.
Location: Texas
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 10:50:33 AM

Comments

I’m Kathy, an alcoholic. Thanks for starting the meeting Solvie and for your words about the mind masquerading as the higher power. Early on, my sponsor warned me of this phenomenon and gave me a Sandy B. tape where he said that we best be careful about hearing the Voice of God because one day God might lean down and say “Hey! Have a beer!”. I have come to realize that communication from my higher power is usually in an unanticipated form and of no specific timing. The only thing I count on is the fact that if I will pray and meditate, the way will be shown and I will have the means to unite with it.


Member:
Location:
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 10:50:56 AM

Comments

He may be beloved of progressives everywhere, but the Rev. V. Gene Robinson, now bishop-elect of the Episcopal Church of New Hampshire, is a flaming fraud. Insensitive, you say? Consider his conduct. Fifteen years ago, Robinson dissolved his marriage, dumped his wife, abandoned his two little girls and went off to shack up. He thus violated his marriage vows, flouted the teachings of the Anglican faith he was ordained to uphold and entered into a sinful liaison his church has always taught was perverted. Having failed to conform his life to scriptural command, Robinson now demands that Scripture be reinterpreted to conform to his deviant life style. To see Robinson elevated to bishop is to be reminded that in the French Revolution, the Paris mob used the high altar at Notre Dame Cathedral to canonize the town tramp as their Goddess of Reason. Now, with massive moral arrogance, Robinson protests that if the Episcopal faithful do not accept him as a consecrated bishop, they -- not he -- will have broken communion and be responsible for dividing the church. Faithless to every vow he ever made, this impious cleric now proclaims undying faith to boyfriend Mark Andrew. My advice to Mark: Have his eminence fitted with one of those ankle bracelets that lets you know where the suspect is every moment of the day. Robinson is being portrayed in the prestige press as a man of moral courage. But a man of moral courage would have stayed with his family, kept his vows, fought his temptations. Robinson ditched his family, dishonored his vows and disgraced himself. He should have been defrocked and excommunicated, not elevated to bishop. As for the Episcopal faithful, they have little choice but to break communion. For if Robinson is morally qualified to be bishop, then Scripture is wrong. If Scripture is right, Robinson is a reprobate. You cannot teach it both ways. Either homosexual acts are immoral or the Episcopal Church has been teaching homophobia 600 years. To witness the moral confusion at the Minneapolis convention of the American Episcopal Church is to understand which way the wind is blowing. Gay rights has become the civil rights cause du jour of our cultural elite, and politicians -- those most reliable of weather vanes -- are signaling recognition of the new correlation of forces. Asked his own views on the morality of homosexuality, the president himself bobbed and weaved, saying, "we are all sinners" and should "respect each individual." When Rep. Janice Schakowsky railed that he had just called gays sinners and should apologize, the White House meekly retorted that President Bush "doesn't believe in casting stones. He believes we ought to treat one another with dignity and respect." In the Big Tent, the only mortal sin is being judgmental. In his answer, however, the president had carefully added, "I think a marriage is between a man and a woman, and I think we ought to codify that." This response was 100 percent political. An amendment to the U.S. Constitution to restrict marriage to a man and a woman is a wedge issue that can rip the Democratic Party apart. As long as President Bush sticks to his Briefing Book, he holds the commanding heights in what is likely to be the fiercest battle of the Culture War in 2004. The Vatican, however, seeing the movement gaining ground, has issued a document of moral clarity calling civil unions "gravely immoral" and homosexual acts "deviant," and urging Christian leaders to oppose homosexual marriages and adoptions. "There are absolutely no grounds for considering homosexual unions to be in any way similar or even remotely analogous to God's plan for marriage and family," declared the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, the Roman Church's watchdog of orthodoxy. Its 12-page guide, approved by John Paul II, states, "Marriage is holy, while homosexual acts go against the natural moral law." With the Episcopal Church heading for schism, the Supreme Court discovering sodomy to be a constitutional right, President Bush maneuvering to back an amendment outlawing gay marriage, and the Pope denouncing homosexual unions as immoral and homosexual acts as deviant, there's no way this issue can be kept out of the campaign of 2004. Nor should it be. But it does reveal a painful truth. America is again a house divided. The "don't ask, don't tell" moral community in which we grew up has dissolved irrevocably. Christianity, dying in Europe, is under siege in America. A paganism that holds homosexual unions to be "sacramental" -- the Rev. Robinson's term -- is ascending. The sad sundered Episcopal Church is a mirror for America.


Member: Bruce N
Location: Houston
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 11:27:28 AM

Comments

It is not surprising that the previous entry has no name or location to it because I am assuming he/she already knows that AA neither supports nor apposses any outside causes. Totally inappropriate place to voice your opinion whoever you are.


Member: Nadine
Location: Finger Lakes
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 11:59:18 AM

Comments

Since the 12 and 12 meeting is also on the 11th step I motion we change the topic and you 11th steppers can share in the other room. Does anyone second my emotion... I mean motion?


Member: Henry
Location:
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 12:03:17 PM

Comments

Henry here and Im an alcoholic, Ive been sober for a long time. The post to-day reminds me of a fellow member who not only went to A.A. but also to - N.A.- G.A.- S.A. Alanon and Emotions Anonymous. They had a total of 72 steps to help them make it through the day. Solvie says she uses Tarot in her meditation. Being from a small Canadian northern town I looked in the dictionary to find out what I may have been missing in my meditation. Tarot is a set of 22 pictorial playing cards, I said to myself... SELF YOU ARE NOT MISSING ANYTHING. As I had the dictionary out I looked up yoga our town population 350 seating capacity in the beer parlor 900 has no yoga, but the dictionary says its a HINDU ASCETIC PHILOSOPHY. So this time I said to myself SELF TELL SOLVIE IF SHES HERE FIRST AGAIN NEXT WEEK TO ASK FOR A TOPIC ON ONE OF OUR SLOGANS ( KEEP IT SIMPLE ) cause lucky for me..... I was simple enough to keep it.


Member: Henry
Location:
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 12:10:25 PM

Comments

New topic Keep it simple


Member: KCM
Location: Florida
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 12:20:42 PM

Comments

Henry, Nadine, and whoever else comes here---You have no authority to change anything, but everybody posts whatever they want anyways, so what's the big deal? The same applies to your post bruce, so what! It can easily be said ANYTHING is an "outside issue" if one chooses to believe that crapola. How 'bout you live and let live if you want others to do it too, huh? Anyone can say whatever they want here, it's not some censoring bureau of AA where no thoughts are allowed other than standard AA jargon. So you want keep it simple---let alkies talk about whatever they think will help them keep from drinking---and none of us get top tell them what that is!


Member: Nadine
Location: Finger Lakes, NY
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 12:25:16 PM

Comments

Okay...KEEP IT SIMPLE... If I don't pray every morning...I simply have a bad day. If I don't stretch every morning{{YOGA}}...I simply experience the inability to have elasticity in my hard headed philosophy. If I don't speak f2f with another alcoholic I simply forget that I'm an alcoholic. If I don't call my sponser, she simply doesn't know when to move me on to the next step. If I don't pick up that first drink, I simply won't get DRUNK!!!!!!! KEEP IT SIMPLE... I LOVE AA!!!! and fishing, Nadine


Member: Nadine
Location: Finger Lakes, NY
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 12:32:33 PM

Comments

I just Simply requested a new topic with a hint of humor sorry you didn't get.... I would have been damed if I didn't make the sugestion to change the topic...if I would have changed it with out asking someone would have posted that the topic is the 11 step go to the coffee pot... I'm all for live and let live in fact it's my favorite slogan. You seem angry is there anything you'd like to share about? my mind and eyes are open to read.. type on...any subject!


Member: Bob
Location: UK
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 12:58:33 PM

Comments

Hi Bob Here .. alcoholic. Just dropping in to read and get some of the feeling from the room. It doesn't serve as a meeting but it helps me to ponder on the week's question. Thanks Solvie ... you jump started me thinking again. I have to be prompted otherwise I get into my 'content-to-be-sober' mood and that's a backward step. Continual vigilance and prayer is more appropriate. Agree with Bruce on the 'no name' diatribe. If I was a practicing Christian I might ask something about 'motes' and 'stones'. However I'm not - I'm just an alcoholic.. and I cannot judge others.. It isn't my right or my job. I continue to pray for enlightenment. Tonight's my home meeting .. maybe I'll see one of you there? Thanks y-all.


Member: sue p
Location: ga
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 2:12:40 PM

Comments

...hi...im sue,an alcoholic. i'm grateful i read everything and didn't end up expressing my very emphatic opinions on things that have nothing to do woth staying sober!...things which,by the way, i used to justify staying drunk!....i do like live and let live!!!!...and i need to remember it! keeping it simple is really a profound idea for me as well. again...i stayed drunk for a long time with some really convoluted thinking!!!thanx for the thoughts and for reading my two cents.


Member: KIMBERLEY
Location: SEATTLE
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 3:12:15 PM

Comments

KIMBERLEY HERE ALCHOLIC, I TRY TO IMPROVE MY CONSCIOUS CONTACT EVERYDAY BUT THTS THE KEY IS TO TRY, THERE IS ONLY ONE DO NOT IN THIS PROGRAM AND THAT IS DO NOT BE DISCOURAGED, IT MUST BE A11 TH STEP DAY AS THATS IS WHATS OUT THER ONLINE TODYA SO ACCEPT THE TH THINGS YOU CANNOT CHANGE, HAVE A GREAT WEEK


Member: Mickey
Location: uk
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 6:15:58 PM

Comments

fuunny thingy is thet peeple only says its outside issues when they dont agrees with it. if they agree then its ok? just made me think is all.


Member: Julie
Location: Chicago
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 6:32:56 PM

Comments

Julie Here, Alcoholic.Thanks for all you comments. This is what helps me: Praying for only the knowledge of his will AND the power to carry it out. If I can quiet my mind and refocus on his will and not mine, how different everything looks. Having the power to carry it out is what I then pray for. Being able to do the next right thing. It is step eleven and keeping it real simple. I don't have to figure it out. Although a pretty bright person, I haven't done well is this area. He figures. I act. Thanks all, Julie


Member: AZbill
Location: az-bill@mindspring.com
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 6:44:18 PM

Comments

HI. Bill here. Alcoholic from Arizona. When I was drinking I was an I specialist. I did and said what I wanted, when I wanted and where I wanted. My family got in the way of my drinking so I trashed them. My job was interfering with my drinking so I quit. Bartender cuts me off, I went to another bar. I came into AA. You all handed me a book. In there it told me that you were going to teach me precisely how you recovered. Now, even coming off a year or so binge I did not have to look up the word precisely. I got on the road to recovery. AHA!! cry the judges. You are off topic!!! Really? In the closing paragraphs in the instructions on how to work the 11th Step. "We alcoholics are undisciplined. So we let God discipline us in the simple way we have just outlined." Thanks for being a part of my sobriety today. And you know what? I love you all and there is not a darn thing you can do about it. LMAO... Bill


Member: David H
Location: nashville
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 7:19:51 PM

Comments

David alcoholic,11 th step great topic and keeping it simple in prayer and meditaion works for me. Here in Nashville ther is an 11th step meeting where you meditate for 15 minutes of silence then have a discussion. They suggest quieting your mind by counting your breaths backwards 10 -1. Try it.


Member: Dennis McG, SD 2-8-99
Location: Lakewood, WA
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 9:08:43 PM

Comments

Hello, all! Dennis, alcoholic here. Thank you for a good topic (or is that topics?) Step 11 is one I rarely do. Followed my sponsor's directions for it in my first year of sobriety -- he lights a candle in a dark room, focuses his attention strictly on the candle and paying attention to his breathing. This did not seem to work well for me. My mind continued to wander everywhere, I couldn't focus. After two weeks, I abandoned the practice and haven't done it since. Does anyone have any suggestions or techniques to share that have worked well for them? And how does one know when they have "heard" their higher power? Thank you for your thoughts....


Member: Dominique
Location: Toronto
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 10:22:15 PM

Comments

I know that I am an alcoholic. I keep rolling back and forth playing games with myself. What I really need someone to tell me because its been so long and I am so lost, is to tell me, show me, give me examples of, how my life will be better if I stop. I 'm scared. It's been my "magic escape potion" for so long. I would appreciate all your comments.


Member: Dale W
Location: W.Y.
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 10:35:51 PM

Comments

Hi! I'm Dale alcoholic.. The 11th step, I hear people calle it maintenance step. well for me it is a neccesity. I have tried along time to maintain my drinking. I've noticed in the past post that the 11th step is centered around prayer, what about reviewing our day? and asking those questions at the end of the day? the 11th step also shows me how to talk with a higher power, something I didn't know how to do.It also shows me how to act. which is something I didn't know how to do. The B.B. talks about what our H.P. wants us to be, not what he wants us to do. I almost always know what to do. just don't always know how to be, (lovingkind, considerate, patient, treat people as i would a sick friend, ect..) at times I don't always act that way. So at night I review my day, which gives me a good a good nights sleep, then in the morning me and H.P. drink coffee, smoke cigs and he lets me know how to (act) or be that day. and when I do that daily I get the rewards it tells me on page88. IT WORKS IT REALLY DOES!!! Thanks


Member: Dale W
Location: W.Y.
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 10:36:20 PM

Comments

Hi! I'm Dale alcoholic.. The 11th step, I hear people calle it maintenance step. well for me it is a neccesity. I have tried along time to maintain my drinking. I've noticed in the past post that the 11th step is centered around prayer, what about reviewing our day? and asking those questions at the end of the day? the 11th step also shows me how to talk with a higher power, something I didn't know how to do.It also shows me how to act. which is something I didn't know how to do. The B.B. talks about what our H.P. wants us to be, not what he wants us to do. I almost always know what to do. just don't always know how to be, (lovingkind, considerate, patient, treat people as i would a sick friend, ect..) at times I don't always act that way. So at night I review my day, which gives me a good a good nights sleep, then in the morning me and H.P. drink coffee, smoke cigs and he lets me know how to (act) or be that day. and when I do that daily I get the rewards it tells me on page88. IT WORKS IT REALLY DOES!!! Thanks


Member: A.A. Old Timer
Location:
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 10:51:36 PM

Comments

There is a direct linkage among self-examination, meditation, and prayer. Taken separately, these practices can bring much relief and benefit. But when they are logically related and interwoven the result is an unshakable foundation for life. The actual experience of meditation and prayer across the centuries is, of course, immense. The world's libraries and places of worship are a treasure trove for all seekers. Pg. 98 12x12 "Keep it simple."


Member: Dick C.
Location: SW VA
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 11:04:55 PM

Comments

Hi Friends, Dick, an alcoholic here.. I don't "hear" or "see" God. I seem to "feel" Him at different times and under different circumstances. When I pray for others, I may get that "feeling". When I am desperate and at my wit's end & pray, I may get that "feeling". When I have had a good day and pray, I may get that "feeling". I thank God daily for his presence in my life and for his Grace which so defies my understanding and without which I would have long ago ceased to exist, I get that "feeling". When I am humbled, I get that "feeling". When I pray for guidance and perception and courage to do His will for me, I get that "feeling". The BB and 12 &12 explain a lot about Steps 3 & 11but I have to try and understand it for me to make it work for me..


Member: Carlc
Location: nm
Date: 8/10/2003
Time: 11:54:45 PM

Comments

Solvie where in the world do you get these long confusing topics? To anyone who has taken and continues to practice the 11th step no discussion is necessary. This step is an action that we do on a daily basis, sought thru prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God, praying only for knowledge of his will and the power to carry it out, that is assuming that I have taken the previous 10 steps. The steps are actions that we take not discuss, because we can discuss them until the cows come home. If we dont change our behavior and the way we think nothing will change.


Member: Carol B.
Location: Northern Nevada
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 1:41:04 AM

Comments

Hello, My name is Carol, I am an alcoholic. I find that the suggestions for prayer and meditation on pages 86-87&88 in the Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous are a wonderful way to get started on finding a conscious contact along with an understanding of God (HP). I also suggest that you DON'T wait until you have completed the first 10 steps before reading those pages (on a daily and nightly basis,) your only cheating yourself while putting this practice off. Dominique, You mention that you are SCARED and that you are LOST. As long as alcohol is your "magic escape potion" anything anyone here could say to you would pretty much be useless to you. Our literature reminds us that we truly HAVE to hit a bottom with our drinking before we are willing to do what our 12 step program requires of us. A bottom is an emotional experience that we have when the pain of thinking about changing our lives is not as great as the pain we are in right at the time. I hope for your sake that you will keep yourself in a place where you will be able to allow yourself to realize the futility of using the "escape route to nowhere" we all used for so long. God will not drag you into recovery kicking and screaming, God will however be ready and waiting to give you all of the Grace necessary to never again HAVE to drink to get through the day. This is my humble opinion only. Take what you need and leave the rest. Solvie, try repeating to yourself several times, "I am powerless over alcohol and my life has become unmanageable". Thanks for allowing me to share with you here.


Member: Russell T.
Location: Floating on the Pacific
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 8:25:15 AM

Comments

Hi, I'm Russell and I'm an Alcoholic. This is a challenge to write, because I have learned that honesty is easier from mind to hand than brain to mouth. Tonight at mass we sang the Elevnth Step prayer. AA has taught me to believe in a power greater than myself and after being sober for a bit of time, I was granted the blessing to join a faith. It doesn't matter which one, it is the action that counts for me. On my path I have done many of the pratices my brother and sister have written about, all that matters is getting that contact. Today, I was able to get out of me long enough to pray and believe. It has made me a better person for today. Faith is like showers, we can't save them up for tomorrow. Love you all.


Member: Titus
Location:
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 9:06:23 AM

Comments

My name is Titus and Im alcoholic I get a little irritated when some'one comes on here thinking they have all the answers and they throw out advise to different posting. If they are so smart why are they here in the first place?? the name of the game is to share our experience strength and hope. Thats a far cry from giving out advise. I know only to well that giving out advise is just a neat way of not looking at ones own screwed up life. I use to do it all the time when I was drinking, of course I was only fooling myself.


Member:
Location:
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 9:53:16 AM

Comments

titus--your experience isnt everything sweety. experience includes seeing what others have doen and doing. so what! you may be fooling yourself now to think otherwise. dom what ya want, and let others do the same mate.


Member:
Location:
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 9:55:24 AM

Comments

titus--your experience isnt everything sweety. experience includes seeing what others have doen and doing. so what! you may be fooling yourself now to think otherwise. dom what ya want, and let others do the same mate.


Member:
Location:
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 9:58:26 AM

Comments

russell-- you sang the St.Francis prayer--NOT the 11th step prayer! aa did not invent the prayer they stoole it from Catholics. its been around a hell of lots longer then 60 sometin little years mate


Member: Mike H
Location: Jackson MI
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 10:12:15 AM

Comments

When I was drinking I was the "God" of my universe. Everything revolved around me. When I was sick and tired enough I quit drinking (with medical help). At that time I allowed AA to be my "God" of the universe. Now after working the steps I allow God to be God and through prayer and meditation I try to follow his direction. I too get a "feeling" rather than a "burning bush" or "bright light" that tends to give me the ideas to follow. Life is much simpler now.


Member: sue p
Location:
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 10:34:25 AM

Comments

......oooo...if this were a philosophical discussion i would not have to bite my tongue so hard!! religious references are dangerous..they can drive people away. when i first became sober my higher power allowed me to NOT see the many references to 'higher power" and 'god' in the big book and the steps.....how many times had i prayed 'just get me out of this one, god' or 'please stop me lord'..etc ad nauseseum...i'm sure everyone is nodding away, remembering their own such prayers...'oh lord, let this just not have happened..you are god,..you can do anything'..so what i needed and what others need are (surprise!) not the same! that is the beauty of aa. we pick sponsors that resonate with us..we go to meetings until we find on in which we are comfortable...when we are ready, or higher pwoer will jerk us up by the short hairs. we eventually even find out things about ourselves that we like!..i am blessed with the ability (usually:):),eventually) to laugh at myself. well..it's a lovely morning in georgia..love (most) of y'all!!


Member: DebLH
Location: WI
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 11:33:23 AM

Comments

Simply, If I practice the 11th step, I can easily practice the other 11 steps and find serenity no matter what is happen in my life. If I neglect to practice this step sernity eludes me no matter how good my life is.


Member: patty
Location: nc
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 4:48:48 PM

Comments

patty-- here alcoholic---hi family...new here and back to aa, after having 5years,i relapsed-- I've been in and out for about three years now, during that time I have moved to a different state, and missed the meetings and people I got sober with. The meetings I go to now seem toxic, and there isn't many in the area, AA saved my life and saved my family. But, today I go to a meeting with a open mind and heart and leave feeling angry and alone. sorry , for not sharing on the topic, I miss unconditional love and acceptance at meetings, and hope to soon find some soon. still shopping for a home group--thanks for letting me share.


Member: Jeff P.
Location: NW Oregon
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 6:17:57 PM

Comments

Hi there! Jeff here, a real live recovering alcoholic. Since I haven't been to any meetings at all in at least 10 years, it might be a bit inappropriate for me to post anything here. But I haven't taken that first drink in something like 19-20 years, so maybe I'm doing something right, dry drunk or no dry drunk. Or not. I'll just try to think good thoughts for today and not harbor too many resentments. Like I always say, "you can't live on resentment- I know because I've tried!"


Member: Fred
Location: Land of Miracles
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 7:24:00 PM

Comments

I have found that eating really healthy, and jogging or whatever excersize you chose, can make for a much easier time, with meditation. because naturally the health and balance my body experiences, from the endorphines or what ever,, just being healthy, makes me more serene and peaceful juring meditation. I drink now and again, and am glad to pronounce that i am of 'sober mind 'sober thought and 'sober actions regardless of the drink i had. i used to be an alcoholic, but not anymore. i don't abuse alcohol, but i used to and could not pick up for years. alot of hard work and healing has been the reason i no longer suffer from the disease' of more' i don't eat to obessity, i don't drink to impairment, i don't gamble to my financial ruin, and i don't sleep with the whole town to destroy my reputation, im for the most part, balanced. i have better things to think about and goals to strive for, there are not enough hours in the day, im basically happy and i hope the miracle happens for anyone who is patient and applies himself or herself as i have. nothing is so out of whack in my life that it is ruining me or others around me. thanx be to the grace of god. Heck i even smoke occasionally, and i love one or two cups of coffee in the morning, but i don't suck on packs and packs of cigs a day, and i don't drink pots and pots of coffee everyday... because it grosses me out, and it makes me feel sick, and i like me today, and i take care of me today, so why would i want to 'self destruct, in 'self destructive ways' when i deserve so much more. although i used to do that to me... i have been long scince healed of my 'diseases'... whether spiritual, physical, mental, emotional and so on. now i can look forward everyday to the more exciting fruitage that life has to offer, like where i would like to travel on holidays, or what new hobbies would i like to take up, like its just a complete turn around from what my life once was. and anyone can have it, all you need is patience, perserverance, and persistance. and it will come. not easy at times, very hard, but miracle can happen for you my friends... that is my prayer for you all today.


Member: FRED
Location: OPPS
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 7:27:23 PM

Comments

OPPS. GO FIGURE. I POSTED IN THE WRONG PLACE. WAS SUPPOSE TO BE OVER AT STEP 11.


Member: sue
Location: ga
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 7:39:57 PM

Comments

..???? say what fred????if you are an alcoholic,you are NOT in recovery!..if you aren't an alcholic..well bless your little ol' heart..good for you! it is really unecessary to point out that you feel better if you are in good health...i believe even alcoholics can figure that out.....i need to quit....i'm downright testy!


Member: sue
Location: ga
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 7:55:34 PM

Comments

..ps...fruitage ????!!!???


Member: Meetingless
Location: In the recliner
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 9:25:26 PM

Comments

0 Meetings in 186 days and I feel fine. 0 Steps in 186 days and I feel fine.


Member: Not Crispy
Location: Meetingmakersmakeitville
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 9:52:24 PM

Comments

A Different Swinging Door- Twelve Concepts, p.72 - When a drunk shows up among us and saysthat he doesn't like AA Principles, people, or service management, when he declares that he can do better elsewhere---we are not worried. We simply say, "Maybe your casereally is different. Why don't you try something else?" If an AA member says he does not like his own group, we are not disturbed. We simply say, "Why don't you try another one? Or start your one of your own." To those who wish to secede from AA altogether, we extend a cheerful invitation to do just that. If they can do better by other means, we are glad. If after a trial they cannot do better, we know they face a choice: They can go mad or die or they can return to AA. The decision is is wholly theirs. (As a matter of fact, most of them do come back.)


Member: psycho Tom
Location:
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 10:08:45 PM

Comments

Hell fire Fred you don't know what your missing. God has blessed me with a healthy body that I don't have to run, jog, or go to the gym to keep in shape. Im tall dark and hansome. and the ladies line up to throw themselfs at me. I can bed down with ten or twelve a week, and feel peaceful and serene after each thrill. My Daddy is a millionaire a few times over and he loves me and my life style. I smoke like a house on fire cause I enjoy all those Cuban cigars. I eat and gourge myself when ever I feel like it. I drink a 45 gallon drum of coffee every morning. I do all this knowing God loves me. Being a spiritual giant can be so stupid boring and glum.... Fred you know what thats like huh? I can gamble all I want but I don't get any pleasure out of it, as its not my money yet. Got to get out of here, as I have so many more important things to do. than worry about my fellow man and yes I am just like God...I love all the ladies


Member: Dick C.
Location: SW VA
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 10:47:47 PM

Comments

Freddie & Psyco Tom need help in much more than grammar & spelling. A wit once said that a person all wrapped up in himself makes a very small package. Maybe drinking, smoking and snorting accentuates their shortcomings. Or maybe they just feel unloved!? Good luck, suckers. Maybe some day you will find that help is for the asking..


Member: Bikerbabe
Location: are we gonna have some fun now?
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 11:21:32 PM

Comments

Bikerbabe here,,, ((phyco tommy!))... sweetheart, hope your not too tall. so i'll have some of what your havin honey. it sounds like fun. whoo hoo!...you want to try out some new age woman?...im gettin paid baby, but im not gettin laid... (enter smug look here)hmm... (enter all in fun attitude here)... and oh yes one more...(enter hope your all judging the crap out of me look here.. ha ha.. whoo hooo eeeeee)))) what say buddy boy?.. you like bootylicious women?.. big boobs and nice eyes and curves all over the place?... you should leave your e-mail... so us lady lovers can have some one on one with ya luv. rotflmao...ha ha ha ha. i love this place. oh ((Fred...deeeeee) good to hear your somewhat somber but sober story again. ((i believe it honey! i believe it!>>>> ive known a few people who have kicked the habit of havin to have a habit" so to speak... you keep on trucking there 'mellow fellow'.... have one for me would ya?... make it a cointreau... straight up or on some ice cream.. m mmm mmm mmmm......


Member: Bikerbabe
Location:
Date: 8/11/2003
Time: 11:24:35 PM

Comments

WHAT AM I SAYING!!!!! (MAKE IT A 'GRAND MARNIER!))


Member:
Location:
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 1:12:56 AM

Comments

Name: Location: Date: 8/12/2003 Time: 1:12:00 AM Comments: bikerbabey come back......,,,,,,yo, yo, yo baby come back!!! Remember that song by Chi-towncago?


Member: just for
Location: not crispy
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 1:19:10 AM

Comments

why quote some stupid book that is by means authoritative to anyone except you and maybe a few other aa brainwashees, no real people you idiot. that means absolutely nothing at all and's a wsste of time.


Member: sue
Location: ga
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 8:28:50 AM

Comments

....wel..shows how one fool can bring out the worst in some folks!...i'm so grateful today that dick c said what i showed almost saintly self control in not saying!..ditto meetingmakersmakeitville (great name)...it is fairly early here in beautiful ga...and today i am grateful thar i woke up without a hangover and feeling paranoid. i am grateful that i can listen and learn..and can even avoid making (REALLY) snappy and clever comebacks to some of the drivel posted here....(ok, i'm not perfect yet)..i am grateful i can thank god this morning for sobriety and the grace to live and let live.....and may god bless us all,eveyone!


Member: lesj
Location: usa
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 12:01:49 PM

Comments

When I took the third step, I accepted a higher power and let "him" take over. It was hard giving my life to a power greater than myself. With the help and guidance of my sponsor, it happened. The 11th steps takes me to an even closer relationship with my HP. I am grateful. Every night, I have a moment of conversation with my HP, reviewing my day..expressing gratitude and asking for help for the next day. For me, it works. I am sober now for the longest continuous period in years and I'm happy. I wish everyone the best in their program.


Member: Connie S.
Location: Nashville, TN
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 12:17:16 PM

Comments

Hi Ya'll, I'm Connie grateful recovering alcoholic, you know what, even when jerks like "just for" post here, I keep coming back because it helps me to hear all the experience, strength and hope ya'll share. Thanks for helping me stay sober another 24. Hope you all get as much out of this as I do.


Member: Connie S.
Location: Nashville, TN
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 1:05:20 PM

Comments

Hi Ya'll - I'm Connie, a grateful, recovering alcoholic. You know, even with jerks like "just for" posting here, I keep comming back because all of you alls experience, strength and hope helps me stay sober one more day. Thanks for being there. And may God bless the sick and suffering both in and out of these rooms - Amen.


Member: Connie S.
Location: Nashville, TN
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 1:40:29 PM

Comments

sorry for dbl dip - thought 1st one didn't take


Member: Aaron H
Location: Toronto Can
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 2:09:56 PM

Comments

Ever since I have put my faith in a higher power things seem to have been getting a little better. I have been to 3 treatments in as many years. My life hit bottom. I might be going to jail for something I did in active addiction. I am having a hard time staying clean. I can't see into the future, and I think that if I go to jail I will relapse. Also "inside" you can't show your real feelings, you must put up a wall. I have just spent the last 3 months breaking down that wall. Please if you have any words of wisdom e-mail me aaronjasonh@hotmail.com Thanks Aaron


Member: rjk
Location: usa
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 4:54:05 PM

Comments

Aaron, Work the system to see if it'll give you another chance. A friend of mine kept his granddaughter out of jail after sending her through a series of evaluations and convincing a reluctant judge to send her to long term treatment (30+ days). She was involved in meth which is almost always guaranteed prison time where I live. You can get lucky if you really want to get better. If you can't avoid prison, hope that theres AA where you're headed. A lot of prisons have AA programs. If not, maybe you can start one. AA General Services has info on prison programs. Good luck.


Member: rjk
Location: usa
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 4:58:44 PM

Comments

You can get lucky if you really want to get better? Lousy wording from me. Let me correct myself: If you really want to get better, you might get lucky and get another chance while avoiding prison.


Member: step 11
Location:
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 5:42:21 PM

Comments

"Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God"..


Member: Susan A.
Location: Vernon, Connecticut
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 6:03:13 PM

Comments

Hi All, I'm Susan and I'm an Alcoholic. Wow, the 'feeling' here is sure a lot different than a couple weeks ago. Step 11 for me is about going even further with bringing my will into alignment with what God (my hp) wants for me. Seeking and then taking action on what I'm guided towards. We are un-disciplined folks. So we let God be our director, and try to build on that daily. Ex: a way to practice step 11 would be to check out what it says up top of this forum, pray and meditate on it, and attempt to do God's will, not Self-will. Thanks all to both the people trying to pass it on to the newcomer, and the people blowing a lot of smoke. Both are good lessons for me.


Member: richard m
Location: sareasota, fla
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 7:06:15 PM

Comments

hi.my name is richard ....i am an alcoholic.....my sobriety date is .....dec 28, 1985.........that is how i had the desire to drink removed......thru prayer and meditation.......i am grateful my church provided the right vehical for me...on that wonder full night as i went to sleep in the bushes,.......i prayed as always to the universal god ..and .he revealed to me .......i needed to learn to live with out drinking....well the next morning ......i arose anew man in by god's will.......and begin living the rest of my life without drinking any alcohol.......i found aa.......and prafctice the "primary purpose ' and encourage others to do the same......love peace and happiness to all .........


Member: Mike-turd
Location: hangin
Date: 8/12/2003
Time: 11:09:19 PM

Comments

Sort of funny really--the 11th step keeps coming up--can't seem to run from it. Hmmm, like the "Hound of Heaven" is chasing me it has so seemed my entire life. You know over on the coffee pot is some really good brew and a short article by a man named Dennis Prager some anonymous poster put up for reasons unbeknownst to me, but it did provoke some thoughts---about this very topic as Fate would have it. I hate labels not only on myself, but applying them pretty much anywhere as it's very limiting, not because it's offensive. His article is about "liberals." I often wonder when people talk about the 11th step and meditation comes up if anyone ever thinks about humility, hmmm yet again. In the article Prager makes a statement that we've all used on occasion, something to the effect that liberals are "child-like." Well, isn't becoming humble and true humility most often displayed in children themselves? Don't we all want Faith as a child has Faith? Sure children question "Why?", but they don't "really" question, they just believe what their parents tell them! Where this really ties in to this step is that I often wonder when people start talking about meditation. All I've ever heard is about Eastern meditation and "emptying" one's mind among various other ways for people to meditate. However, traditional Christian meditation is the exact opposite. It is about contemplation and "filling" one's mind. I've been sober a long time and other than priests, I've never heard this mentioned one single time. I can't help but wonder why that is? Think about it---or don't think about it---it's still a choice, just as Prager has chosen to "box-in" the "You're acting like a child" statement. I only pray I can indeed act "child-like" enough to please my Lord and I am by NO means a "liberal!" See what I mean about labels?


Member: sue
Location:
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 7:38:17 AM

Comments

.....yes, we do love our labels, don't we ?.........as regards meditation...i think the idea is to empty ones mind of the extraneous chatter that goes on continually...in our case usually negative noise. ....and however one can accomplish that effectivly is the right way for that person!........aha! live and let live!! the whole idea being to open our hearts and minds!...to god as we understand (or don't) , to each other, to new ideas...and to filter it all through the "is it kind? is it necessary? is it useful?" filter....or,as we say..'can i change it?..should i change it?..should i let it go and let god?....enough from m!e this am..blessings to all


Member: Joe P
Location: Chicago
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 10:23:45 AM

Comments

My name is Joe, and I am an alcoholic. Step 11 - Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God, as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out. Lots of words, but really quite simple instruction contained right there in the wording of the step. Be a seeker. For me, that means the intentional and willful act of looking to be aware of god’s presence in the world. And we seek to improve our consciousness of God. I had begun some awareness of God in the prior 10 steps, and here I am instructed to build on that awareness. And we seek to improve our awareness of God through prayer and meditation. I like the definitions of prayer as talking with God, and meditation as a listening for God’s response. These can take many different forms. I have formal prayers like the 3rd and 7th Step Prayers and times of informal prayer. We practice quiet meditation and contemplative meditation. The 12 & 12 has an example of contemplative meditation based on the Prayer of St. Francis. The 12 & 12 also encourages us to seek outside of AA. “The world’s libraries and places of worship are a treasure trove for all seekers.” (p. 98) Thanks for all the comments.


Member: Kim D.
Location: Bridgewater
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 2:28:20 PM

Comments

Hmmm... Carlc's statement that you do Step 11 after you've completed 1-10 got me thinking... is that necessarily true? Say for instance, I've been writing part of my Step 4 for while now. However, I do ask God for direction in my life, for knowledge of His will and the desire to carry that out. I do try and meditate by doing yoga in the AM or reading my 24 hours book. Why does one have to exclude Steps 10 & 11 just because they haven't done the ones inbetween? Non-alcoholics pray for God's Will in their lives and they don't have to do Steps 1-10 to do so... Just a thought.


Member: step 11
Location:
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 3:19:35 PM

Comments

"Prepare thine heart to seek the Lord"..


Member: Hank
Location:
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 4:40:49 PM

Comments

17 years I'm still on step 1


Member: sober for today
Location:
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 6:49:43 PM

Comments

Kim its suppose to be a simple program for complicated people. try not to twist that around. Just keep it simple or better still get simple enough to keep it. Its an individual program thats why we don't have priests and ministers preaching to. On the clubroom wall you will see a slogan that say ...THINK... THINK...THINK. Try doing it it really works well.


Member: Robin
Location:
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 8:25:40 PM

Comments

Hello everyone, I am Robin and I am an alcoholic. I have been sober for 9 months and like Kim I am still on step 4 but I didn't start the steps until I had been sober 6 months. I've been doing step 11 ever since I became sober and it has helped with my other steps. I don't attend many meetings for numerous reasons, however, today I did and experienced a confusing situation and wondered if anyone had some insight for me. I mentioned that my higher power was Jesus and a complaint was given to my sponsor asking me not to use that 'word'. It wasn't like I pushed anything on anyone I just said that without Him I probably wouldn't be here today and now I get the feeling the person with the complaint wished I wasn't. I was told God is okay but not Jesus. One lady in the meeting has a higher power that is a tree...I fail to see the reasoning why I can't say Jesus. Does anyone have any comments on this? Thanks.


Member: D.O'K
Location: Idaho
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 8:37:02 PM

Comments

do it every day. Through days,weeks,months,and years! Then do we have it all together, well I hope not. You know what they say about having it all together do'nt you? So just keep working this step, and all the rest! Thats the way you keep your peace,serenity, and sobriety.


Member: CB
Location: LORAIN >OHIO U.S.A
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 8:40:06 PM

Comments

HAY , people fire water is what & TODAY , money do'nt have to pay and not a live in a jail today three hundred and fifty eight day . JUST where I would be today . just sick of all the sick kayous god bless all of my hp in as we get better today just one day at a time


Member: CB
Location: LORAIN >OHIO U.S.A
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 8:40:07 PM

Comments

HAY , people fire water is what & TODAY , money do'nt have to pay and not a live in a jail today three hundred and fifty eight day . JUST where I would be today . just sick of all the sick kayous god bless all of my hp in as we get better today just one day at a time


Member: CB
Location: LORAIN >OHIO U.S.A
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 8:42:06 PM

Comments

HAY , people fire water is what & TODAY , money do'nt have to pay and not a live in a jail today three hundred and fifty eight day . JUST where I would be today . just sick of all the sick kayous god bless all of my hp in as we get better today just one day at a time


Member: SM
Location: NY
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 9:18:37 PM

Comments

Dear Robin, I think that wasn't right. It doesn't matter what one's beliefs are about their HP, as long as it works for them. It is a very personal thing. As seen by this discussion group, tolerance is the key toward others' viewpoints. Whether we call our higher power Buddha, Jesus, Krishna, or the Goddess, or even our Higher Self, is no one else's concern. You might do better to find a group where you DO feel more welcomed and in simpatico with the rest of the members. Once a week I go to an 11th step meeting which is only singing and meditating. The songs are all very Jesus oriented. It is lovely. I myself happen to think of my higher power more in tune with a higher self, but also combining aspects I've learned from buddhism and goddess worship. However, the FEELING at this meeting is what draws me there. Wish you lived in town, I would take you with me... God Bless.


Member: ROBIN,YOU DONT NEED A SPONSOR
Location: OUT OF AA AND OWN YOUR WAY TO CHURCH FOR JESUS
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 9:38:09 PM

Comments

Yes a higher power of your own understanding.Yep that is what they tell you when you first attend AA or any other step program.But once you get sucked in you better tow the line or you will be made to feel as an outcast until you succumb to their way of thinking. Robin,no one needs a sponsor,lol,sponsor telling you what to do and someone else telling the sponsor what to do,just one big circle jerk,if you sobered up on your own for 6 months then you are on your way to a better life unless you choose to booze.Go to church and worship your Jesus,most churches have activities several nights a week.Bible study one night,visiting new members one night,service Sunday and Wednesday night.Service Sunday morning.So stop hanging out with the AA crowd and hang with the Jesus followers.But for sure Robin,ask your sponsor first if it is ok before giving up AA and going to church.He might not let you since he is the puppetmaster,oh yes believe it,if he was any true sponsor or friend he would have stood up for you.But of course if you deserve to be treated that way then tell your sponsor THANK YOU for pointing out your wrong.


Member: RUN ROBIN RUN
Location: ALL THE WAY TO CHURCH
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 9:46:55 PM

Comments

Robin,if you have not drank for 9 months then you are no longer an ALCOHOLIC.But if you choose to booze again then you will be an ALKIE again,Stop labeling yourself with that title and keeping your self esteem and self worth and self will at eye level with the gutter,how long do you have to bear that title,FOREVER.


Member: Marty
Location: Michigan
Date: 8/13/2003
Time: 9:48:23 PM

Comments

Robin dear, I've a lovely suggestion since you asked. Simply ask them why they view it o.k. to mention a tree, doorknobs are big ones too, or whatever, but not Jesus? Nothing is ever said if one mentions Allah, Buddha, the Dali Lama, or anything else, but yet these same nuts go crazy when the very name of the Saviour of the World is mentioned, why is that? It's because the spiritual battle is severe in AA and there's only way to overcome the ignorance---battle back. I've been sober a good-long time and dare the bastards to say anything to me, but they like to "pick on" newcomers. Make no mistake--9 months is great, but it's still very new and many people in AA will take advantage of your weakness because of their problems, not yours. You sound like a fine lady off to a beautiful start, don't let a few idiots get you down. Fight back and tell 'em if they don't like it that's fine too, but your Rock has a name---Jesus Christ! Plus if you really want to get 'em all excited tell 'em that the steps are directly out of the Bible through the Oxford Group. That always gets 'em stirred up to as it's the facts yet you'll also have many who deny even that simplistic historical knowledge. God Bless you dear woman, you give me hope for AA, just don't quit because of them!


Member: Carlc
Location: nm
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 12:15:53 AM

Comments

See what you started Solvie, when you pick a topic, pick one topic please, you pick topics like a magician pulls rabbits out of a hat.


Member: Steven L
Location: Mentone, CA
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 12:34:04 AM

Comments

Robin, Steven here @15+ years--not being a christian I have felt I have been presented with opportunities to grow when people talk about Jesus as their personal savior and/or higher power. People have been getting sober far longer than AA has been around...Page 82 of the 3rd edition says, "we feel a man is unthinking who says sobreity is enough." In other words (my interpretation ONLY--based on my 15 years of experience) all the steps are for is to let you meet and live with a power greater than yourself which YOU can learn to trust--Do whatever keeps you progressing toward YOUR undestanding of YOUR higher power. A man I admire greatly, who has twice as much sobreity as I says it best, "Comfort the disturbed and disturb the comforted." My sponsor rarely tells me what to do, he just tells me what HE DID. If he has no experience with what I am dealing with, he tells me to go find someone who has experience with what I am dealing with. CONTROL IS NOT AN OLYMPIC EVENT--although many in AA act like it should be. Be Well And Keep Coming Back !


Member: sue
Location: ga
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 1:00:56 AM

Comments

...robin..you may of course have jesus as your higher power.....and the person that comlained about it needs to get out the ole big book !another thing to keep in mind is that sobriety does not necessarily guarentee that there will be no redneck, jerks,and idiots in aa. aa is an open group...the only requirement is a desire to stop drinking! aa does however give us the opportuities to pray and meditate..and to live and let live among the aforementioned dolt!


Member: terry
Location: nebraskaa
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 2:34:23 AM

Comments

Thank yu fer sharin that steve from cali. that was nice and i liked it alot. that is true tolerance and love to say what yu did and yu dont bbelieve in Him. thank yu for jus bein kind and true to the code. peace for yu.


Member: Vic V.
Location: mexico
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 7:25:14 AM

Comments

Hi My name is Vic an I am an Alcoholic. funny how I stop doing the 11th step and going to meeting and stop taking to other alcoholic. I relapes about two month ago. But I am back. I'm not on the 11th step yet, because my sponser told me to start all over again. But i found this sight and I needed to from most of you.


Member: Old timer
Location:
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 7:46:24 AM

Comments

STEVE L. From Mentone You say control is not an OLYMPIC EVENT Then go on to say many in A.A.act like it should be. You should make a list of the many who act like it should be and send a copy to G.S.O in New York, also give a copy to your sponser, Just to see what he has to say. but even more important supply each and everyone of those controlers a copy. Who knows you may even create a perfect program. Remember to add the most important name of all on it.


Member: I WAS AN OLDTIMER
Location: TIL I TOOK OFF THOSE ROSE COLORED GLASSES
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 8:36:39 AM

Comments

Get on with your life Oldtimer.Take off those damn ROSE COLORED GLASSES and see things the way they are.Who gives a RATS ASS what the Oldtimers in NY and any damn SPONSOR has to say.DOWN WITH THE STEP BULLSHIT.If one wants religion then go to church. Yes right,children grow up and some make mistakes and get addicted to certain things and then they are expected to do these damn steps forever because some jerk tells them that they will fail if they dont.AA and other step groups are the biggest crock of BULLSHIT around.Oldtimer just because you choose to wear those ROSE COLORED GLASSESS does not mean everyone is blind to the facts.


Member: day day day
Location: chay chay chay
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 3:20:11 PM

Comments

Tis for freedom Christ has set us free, stand fast therefore in the liberty that is in Christ Jesus and desire not to be intangled again in a yoke of bondage For what does it profit a man to gain the whole world and loose his very soul? He that finds his life shall loose it and the program is designed around a start to finish get a drift to what God's word has to say which will put off the old man and put on the new..a say way..


Member: day day day
Location: chain chain chain
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 3:22:19 PM

Comments

chay chay chay and tay way day pie why everywhere I go Jesus is Lord and everywhere I go say way day and tay way day pie why I don't think its worthy of why..


Member: RICHARD B
Location: K
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 3:51:01 PM

Comments

stay with the basics ,beleive in something!!! even if its yourself, and " KISS " keep it simple stupid. i've got 16 yrs in the aa program and thats what i had to do, and not a shame of being a real drunk and beleive in a god of my understanding mine is portable and can take him anywhere i go, oh i'm richard a drunk from kansas lov you all


Member: AFTER 16 YEARS YOU SHOULD FOR SURE BE CURED
Location: IF THE PROGRAM WORKED,MY CONDOLENCES TO YOU FOR YOUR CONTINUED IGNORANCE
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 5:25:55 PM

Comments

Richard B. Keep things simple if they are simple,if things are not simple then use those brain that the GOD of your understanding gave you.Never Richard under any circumstances NEVER EVER let some dumbass call you STUPID unless of course you are STUPID. If you have been clean for a number of years Richard you are no longer a drunk,but if you have been swallowing that AA BULLSHIT for 16 years and still a drunk then Richard the program has failed you.It sounds as if the program has stripped you of your own self decency by having you label yourself with self defeating names.


Member: robm
Location: california
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 10:58:14 PM

Comments

I am deeply troubled by the whole "tone" of this meeting. So much anger, discord and ego. I am hear to find a Good Orderly Direction to keep me sober. Frankly, if you are not an alcoholic, if you don't believe in the 12 steps, the big book or the AA program, WHY ARE YOU HEAR. It seems that there a several people participating in the group who are ANTI - AA and are using this place as a forum to vent their personal issues. If you are here to do AA, then welcome, if not, then please go elsewhere.


Member: Fred
Location: Miracle land.
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 11:15:40 PM

Comments

Apparently there is no "SOLID PROOF" scientifically, or otherwise that ALCOHOLISM IS A DISEASE...and still people continue to act like its the law or something because the big book says so'.. well the big book just like the bible says alot of stuff that would leave one in the 'grey area'... and just like religion. aa takes these things all the way to the bank. they stop questioning, they stop thinking for themselves, and pretty soon. alocoholism is a disease, because the big book said so... no further engagement of their mental faculties. 'ITS ASTONISHING' i would agree however that it is a 'dis' 'ease'. and i feel it is really sad, to see so many people who are focusing on it as such,and staying on in aa because of the brainwashing and fear producing mantra's its some pretty sick buisness in my proffesional opinion. Further more, there seems to be more and more people who become "less of the human beings they once were capable of, because of continued overindulgence in aa. Just recently i have seen a couple who once were like model citizens, married, working, lovely prospects on children and so forth, and staying sober. i have watched them deteriorate as a result of constant exposure to aa's very sick and disfunctional environment and people. AA's 'naturally sick majority of individuals who frequent it are not a good lot to expose yourself to on a regular basis. The 'pair now have children, the Father has become 'unemployed, the Mother is on 'antidepressants. and i think the Father had another slip not long ago. In fact i think they are even looking worse in appearance. At one time they were both working with very good jobs, because they have completed some post secondary pursuits. It is just my opinion, but it seems you have to be down pretty low in order to have anywhere 'up' to go in aa. and once you get up its like you better move on or your going back down. maybe not for everyone. but ive seen this quite a bit now. sad. i personally have benefitted tremendously in all areas of my life scince i 'removed myself from the throes of the aa program,,, it may not be the case with aa everywhere, but it seems to be here. And i know of several people who although they once were into playing sports, and living life, working and so forth.. are now on welfare, sitting in the coffee shops bumming coffee and smoking to the point of yellowed teeth, where they once had white teeth.. and they have been sober for years and years. some over 10 years sober. some over 15 years sober and deteriorating. its very sad. if i was going to do it all over again, i think i would get into 'golfing' and make that my new obsession.. to stay sober, rather than aa. at least that way i would maybe have gotten to the finals' and won some serious money to boot


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: 8/14/2003
Time: 11:48:37 PM

Comments

I'm with Rob M. Go back to RR where all they do is slam AA. Was that getting boring so you have to be a simple minded pest and a cowardly one at that and bug everyone here? Why not go to a live AA meeting and tell everyone there what you think?! No that would take nads and you obviously have none. I never want to be as dry as you are. You forgot where you came from and what got you sober to begin with. Maybe try writing a gratitude list instead of sour grapes here? Move it along, your loitering here is not appreciated. Kelly :(


Member: Ron L.
Location: Winnipeg. Man. Can.
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 6:37:21 AM

Comments

My name is Ron and Im an alcoholic. After more than 30 years as a sober member of A.A. attending meetings on a regular basis I have asked myself why do I still go to 3-4 mgt. a week. Well first off I enjoy going and I have made some truely fine friends there who are also doing the same thing, after all is it not a fellowship? I know that the primary purpose of A.A. is to stay sober and carry its message In the past 30 years I went from a drunk who lost wife, children, home, freedom, self respect,and the ability to love another human being, I now have those back and a new wife. Im not going to spout off about my material gains, but I do have my health, a healthy brain, and a body that looks 20 years younger than its age. I still read the A.A. material and enjoy its many books... the big book, Dr. Bob, A.A. comes of age. daily reflections. only to mention a few.I enjoy being around alcoholics who are trying to recover using the program. Some of the things that I have stopped doing in the past 30 years is sticking my nose into places it does not belong. Being critical of the beleifs and life style of others. I don't try to change others and get them to live the life style I am living, yet they seem to want what I have, so I share my experience, strenght, and hope with them, This is only a few of the reasons why I still am a member of A.A. It has worked in my favor and is still working in my favor or is it really God and A.A. has nothing at all to do with it. I wouldent agree to that cause I believed in God while I was a drunk, I prayed that God would give me my wife and childern back, my freedom, money, I am not going to take a chance by taking a drink so as to find out what came first,A.A. is my insureance that I won't take a drink, I will just con't on as is because Im enjoying every bit of it. Now to those who might say " get a life " I would have to say leave me along and get your own life I an very happy......ARE YOU????


Member: Mike
Location: In a blackout of a different kind
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 9:23:34 AM

Comments

Not true, as I for one enjoy the "alternative" points of view and they are very much appreciated. It's a nice break from all the non-thinking, parroting of phrases that are maybe halve-truths at best. I don't necessarily agree with what he/she says, but I still find it of some benefit. Besides, who's to say who's not "allowed" here or in AA? Nobody here nor anywhere, it's totally up to individuals to decide for themselves and AA is supossed to be about "tolerance" so why all the just leave, leave, leave, rhetoric? I would suggest that you are the ones whom should leave if you don't like it as you nor anyone has the authority to tell anyone else to leave, we only control whether or not we ourselves stay. There's a billion(ish) meetings both on-line and in the real-world, if you don't like the one you're at, go find one you do---it's not hard! However, all it does is give AA an aura of exactly what its principles are supposed to stand against when one starts shouting and screaming, "off with his head," simply because they don't tow the AA party line. It can be truly spiritually enlightening if one chooses to absorb and learn what is being said through "different" views. Even if it's "To understand all is to forgive all." Either way, positive or negative, there is something to be learned from everyone, the key is in the art of listening.


Member: RICHAD B
Location: KANSAS
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 9:28:56 AM

Comments

hello i'm richard still the drunk for those who understand!!! and those don't you see i had to be a drunk to become an alcoholic . and still not ashame defeating names and still got 16 yrs


Member: Becky
Location: Seattle
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 10:57:52 AM

Comments

My name is Becky. Went to my first meeting two days ago. Am still drinking...I'd like to quite but wish I could just "manage" it. Am smart enough to know that is dumb.


Member: I HAVE A DISEASE,WHATS YOUR EXCUSE?
Location: BILL W'S WONDERLAND
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 11:49:39 AM

Comments

It's my disease that I can blame things on.Please dont take my crutch away from me cause then I will have to take responsibility for my ongoing ignorance.


Member: SYMPATHISER
Location: PRAYING FOR YOU
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 11:55:38 AM

Comments

Richard B. We are sorry to hear that you are still an alcoholic drunk after 16 years.


Member: lastgasper
Location: surfinthru
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 12:32:40 PM

Comments

suremam glad the topics not the 12th step...you sorryassed excuses for real AAs sure carry a shitty message...a newbe might look at all this bickering bullshit and decide that your kind of "soberity" aint no different than sitting on the barstool with all the other assholes.


Member: One Who Knows...
Location: Here
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 4:46:23 PM

Comments

DON'T FEED THE TROLLS. IF YOU FEED THEM - THEY GROW. IGNORE THEM - SHARE YOUR ES&H BETWEEN EACH OTHER - AND THEY WILL WITHER AND DIE.


Member: Kim D.
Location: Bridgewater
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 4:48:29 PM

Comments

Sober for Today... That's what I'm doing... Think, think, thinking... Sharing questions with other AAer's that might be able to help clarify the question I have. Do you have an answer other than THINK THINK THINK?????


Member: thy
Location: usa
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 5:28:13 PM

Comments

AA invites people to try anything they want to stay sober. AA doesn't claim to be the sole answer. From practical, time tested experience, AA works for most alcoholics. The program provides a plan, a way of life and support to stay sober. If a person doesn't like AA..thats fine. For folks who are looking to stay sober today, I suggest you give the AA program a try..it might be worth your time. People swear by AA..have stayed sober for years and are happy. Some folks think differently. Try AA, give it a chance and then make up your own mind. For the lady on the Jesus as Higher Power: You can name your own Higher Power and if its Jesus..right on. Don't be intimidated by people who disagree. AA is very democratic and everyone's welcome to their own opinion. Stand by yours if it helps keep you sober.


Member: Becky
Location: Seattle
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 5:57:43 PM

Comments

I excpected a bit more help from my posting...guess I'd better go back to a meeting.


Member: GET INFORMED
Location: THEN RUN YOUR MOUTH
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 6:14:23 PM

Comments

THY,WHERE ARE YOU GETTING YOUR STATS FROM.AA HAS ABOUT A 4% TO 6% SUCCESS RATE AT BEST AND THAT IS STRETCHING IT AND MOST OF THOSE ARE THE OLD TIMERS WHO DO NOT HAVE ANYTHING ELSE TO DO.IF YOU ARE GOING TO POST INFORMATION AT LEAST BE ACCURATE


Member: Salty Sam
Location: USA
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 10:07:12 PM

Comments

Titus...Thanks for the great advise


Member: Salty Sam
Location: USA
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 10:12:46 PM

Comments

Not Crispy....You are in tune. Thankyou


Member: Salty Sam
Location: USA
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 10:27:14 PM

Comments

One who knows....Good go.


Member: Salty Sam
Location: USA
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 10:28:14 PM

Comments

Get Informed..Excellent advise...The newbeeies are confused enough


Member: Salty Sam
Location: USA
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 10:29:33 PM

Comments

Becky...when you pray for potatoes...pick up a hoe!


Member: .Salry Sam
Location: USA
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 10:32:40 PM

Comments

Dear Thy..AA is for those who want it and it never fails...The trail to soberiety is lined with those who have quit trying


Member: .Salty Sam
Location: USA
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 10:36:01 PM

Comments

SYMPATHYSER!!!!Most of us suffer from Acoholism not Alcoholwasim


Member: .Salty Sam
Location: USA
Date: 8/15/2003
Time: 10:42:30 PM

Comments

The older the piano the mor apt it is to be out of tune...A piano tuner is much needed at this meet


Member: NOT SALTY
Location: AND GLAD OF IT
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 1:50:46 AM

Comments

Salty Sam, Come on Salty,spew out some of those ridiculous slogans.Those work so well even after all these years.There is nothing wrong with trying AA in the beginning days of putting down the poison of alcohol.But get real Salty there is no need in having to swallow that garbage forever.GET OVER IT SALTY.There are plenty of people who have chosen to quit drinking who still have their own mind and do not have to go around parroting useless meaningless hurtful slogans.GET OVER IT SALTY.


Member: Dave S
Location: South Dakota
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 2:05:59 AM

Comments

To Fred--It's glaringly obvious that you dont's attend AA meetings yourself. "Brain washing and fear producing mantras" ? Where did you discern this information? You say in your "professional opinion" but fail to say what your profession is or what your credentials are. Let me tell you about my credentials. I am a drunk, just a plain old fashioned drunk. I don't claim to be anything else. I am a sober drunk and have been for quite some time. I am not a professional anything, nor do I claim to be. By the grace of God and my friends in this program I am sober today, the only day that matters. I have never been brainwashed. Nor am I unemployed, or spend all of my time sitting in a coffeshop. I must, however, admit to smoking. I would like to see your scientific proof that says alcoholism is not a disease, many professional counsellors, doctors, lawyers, and even the US government and all branches of the Armed Forces regard alcoholism as a disease and treat it as such. The meetings I go to are generally happy occasions, and if I "overindulge" in them a bit, I consider if to be far more beneficial to my life then the chemical substances I used to overindulge in. I am not saying that the examples of people you noted as "deteriorated" by the AA program are not true. But I will tell you that these folks are by far the exception rather than the rule. The majority of people I have met in my considerable time in this program are truly magnificent human being whose love of life and love for their fellow men is a quality if emulated would lead to a much more peaceful and productive world. Hopefully, you just wrote your letter as a joke, or to get a rise out of someone. Well, my friend, you got a rise out of me. I feel sorry for you, and pray to God that you will take a long, honest look at the people in this progam and a look at yourself and reevaluate some of the issues. If you did it as a joke, all I can say is don't take up comedy as a career, you'll get mighty hungry.


Member: ITS MY DISEASE
Location: PLEASE DONT TELL ME THE TRUTH I JUST CANT HANDLE IT
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 3:22:28 AM

Comments

Dave S., How long, just how long do you have to call yourself a drunk.GET OVER IT DAVE if you no longer drink and get intoxicated then you are no longer a drunk.But if you want to attend the MONKEY SEE MONKEY DO meaningless AA DOGMA meetings and hear the same things over and over and over then I guess you will always have to keep your labels to tow the line or you will be accused of not working the endless steps.Why is it called the 12 step program when it last forever.Come on Dave S. go ahead and confess it ,yep, your a miracle too,do you also do tricks too.Kick those crutches out from under your armpits and live man,just get on with the living or your tombstone will read DAVE S. 19WHATEVER -AND STILL IN RECOVERY.Under the 12 step plan you will never be recovered.Now put down those nasty cancer sticks.If that 12 step BULLSHIT is so powerful then why after all the hard step work did you not work on that life sucking disease,yep thats a disease too.I hope I got a rise out of you Dave S. well more like I hope you take off those AA issued ROSE COLORED GLASSES AND STEP ON THEM AND BE A REAL MAN instead of a puppet or worse yet a puppetmaster.


Member: The world according to Bikerbabe
Location: kiss kiss, hug hug.
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 3:46:11 AM

Comments

The only reason that the majority of secular proffesions.. namely (doc's lawyers, councillors etc. ) regard alcoholism as a disease is because aa' has used 'god' to get some sympathy from these people. let me tell you something smarty, there exists 'all forms of spiritual dis' 'eases' in this world, and every single one of them requires the same medicine to overcome..WORK' EFFORT' REALITY CHECKS. and i can think of nothing worse than using 'a spiritual crutch and 'god' to get off easy. there is no quick fix. it is always the same. 'the individual must put in the effort required to get better' period. This is known as "taking responsibility" to the lay/ignorant person. "look' aa likely does help many, but i think there's a new spiritual revelution on the rise here people, and its coming whether you want it to or not. Statistically speaking, aa does fail a great majority... and when something isn't working to well, its going to die out. Myself and other people who are "awake" are coming here as a gift to you all, bearing the message in no uncertain terms. Likely aa will end up on the mat,(just like the church)..hmmm.... under the scope and in judgement, (hmm just like the church from whence AA came) .. it will fall away in time. Its called <<change<< people. anyone heard of change? Or did you think change was only going to happen in your little life? Change will happen on a much bigger scope and scale, slowly maybe quickly. aa came from the bible, and the bible itself is in desperate need of a sequel... and its coming, so get ready and get excited if you want.. that's what im doing.Incidentally, the statistics of church goer's who actually are capable of 'practicing what they preach is likey comparable to aa er's who can manage to stay sober, WAKE UP PEOPLE.. THE WHOLE WORLD HAS BEEN HIDING BEHIND RELIGIONS.. AND AA IS JUST ANOTHER RELIGION' HIDING BEHIND ALCOHOLISM...LORD LOVE US! thank you, thank you very much, i'll just collect my pulitzer at the door, on my way out... bye now. ps. Jesus would be proud. BBBBRRRRAAAAAK! BRAK!


Member: Bikerbabe
Location:
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 3:49:27 AM

Comments

Oh yes, i almost forgot,,, oh yoo hooo (DAVE)are you hot?... smootchy gootchie... kissy wissy,, huggy wuggy... ha ha ha.... hey its Friday... im philisophical on friday... But im still happy..... whoo hooo....... love peace and a brand new skull cap for ya Dave...


Member: new guy I think
Location:
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 4:13:37 AM

Comments

My name is Henry and Im an alcoholic. Ive got a few 24 hours of sobriety now and I would like to ask those who are critical of old timers in A.A. exactly how long I should go to meetings or how many meetings I should go to before I become one of those old timers who seem to really offend those who think they know about these things. Where do you find that line that once crossed your tagged as brain washed... is it after 3 months or 3 weeks. At what point do I go to meetings only because you have nothing better to do. I was told that A.A. is not life it self, but a way of life. So tell me how many meetings would you allow me to go to. God only knows I woulden't want to become an old timer they seem to have found happiness, peace of mind, and serenity. Maybe when I start walking around with a smile on my face, and people start to say how much Ive changed will be a good time to leave. My wife says she loves me now, and my 2 little kids want me to play with them, That has to be a good indicator that Ive over stayed my recovery time, My boss gave me a raise in pay last week. Well please tell me how much longer have I got before I start to offend you, What will you do for your past time once you get everyone talking and acting like you want them to talk and act? Maybe you could start a 12 step program for people who are hooked on 12 step programs


Member: ANOTHER SARCASTIC OLD TIMER
Location: AND POWER HUNGRY TOO
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 4:31:57 AM

Comments

OLD NEW GUY,GET OVER IT,IF YOU DONT DRINK THEN YOU ARE WELL.IF YOU WANT RELIGION,THEN GO TO CHURCH.SURE IF AA HELPED YOU QUIT DRINKING THEN GOOD,BUT YOU IDIOT IT WAS YOU WHO MADE YOU STOP DRINKING NOT THOSE DAMN 12 STEPS.NOW THAT YOU ARE WELL GET BUSY WITH YOUR FAMILY AND STOP TAKING TIME AWAY FROM THE FAMILY TO HOLD DOWN A SEAT IN A MEETING AND GIVE IT UP TO MAKE ROOM FOR SOME DRINKER THAT NEEDS THAT INITIAL SHOCK THERAPY THAT AA PROVIDES.I BET YOU HAVE ENOUGH CHIPS FOR 5 OR 6 GUYS TO PLAY POKER WITH AND MORE PINS THAN A 4 STAR GENERAL.YOU DUMBASS YOU'LL DIE IN RECOVERY NOT KNOWING THAT YOU WERE THE ONE WHO MADE YOURSELF A RESPONSIBLE PERSON.NOW TAKE OFF THOSE AA ISSUED ROSE COLORED GLASSES AND STEP ON THEM 12 TIMES AND KEEP THAT SARCASTIC BULLSHIT YOU SPEWED OUT IN YOUR PREVIOUS POST AND STUFF BACK WHERE IT CAME FROM.ANOTHER DAMN CHIP COLLECTOR.


Member: Barbara V.
Location: Michigan, USA
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 4:41:03 AM

Comments

Hey I am an alcoholic, but I do not believe in the disease theory. Drinking is a choice. I truly believe I have the choice to drink or not to drink...though I may need some help in making these choices... AA has given me hope because I find I am not alone in my desire to drink--"rocking good news" for me--since I feared no one would understand my self-defeating compulsions! Also, I have an opportunity to associate with people who are no longer relying on alcohol in order to be "social." (Non-drinkers are great people to hang out with when you do not want to drink...yo!) Okay, so I may not agree with everything AA has to offer, but I do know that this support group is a wonderful alternative to the drinks and the drunks I once knew. Sobriety is not necessarily an easy choice for the alcoholic, but with A.A. Meetings, one can see that sobriety is indeed, possible. AA has been an excellent support group for millions of people--and if one opens his/her eyes--one might find much wisdom in its principles. Let go of your need to control...life isn't easy, and when you can acknowledge this basic fact, it really does get a lot less complicated...on most days anyways... While we ought to take responsibility for our actions--we should not spend our lifetimes regretting them. AA is not about puppets and puppet-masters, it is a simple program to help people live in peace (through forgiveness and/or tolerance of man's struggles and imperfections.) See a real man can go to AA for help...but a man with false courage can only puff up his chest and pretend he needs no one...when in fact, all of human existance has been dependent upon others...unless of course we are speaking of Superman (hmmm...isn't he from another planet?)


Member: yo-yo
Location: somewhere in america its raining
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 5:12:25 AM

Comments

HAHA Bikerbabe your cute!!! but has AA failed anyone?? wasnt there a book out awile ago titled: "how AA failed me". Ive never understood this, its like,did i pay to get in? and didnt get my moneys worth? please enlighten me, I like the story in the bible,(OHoh) about when Jesus cast out the demons of this crazy man, and sent the demons into the pigs and the pigs jumped over the cliff, then the man is sitting quietly in his right mind and the people from his village were freaked out by this cause they knew him as a crazy man,and the man wanted to go with Jesus but was told to go to his village and Share what God has done for him.


Member: Bikerbabe to yo yo...
Location: kissy kissy
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 6:56:01 AM

Comments

hey ((yo yo.... GO F@#K YOURSELF!! (enter ha ha and a lighthearted smile here)) you wish! I just can't stand it when somebody says something contrary to what the great and powerful 'I' HAS SAID!!! I hate you all, your all fags now...(ohhhh don't you just love any reason to argue with others? round and round and round we go...<<by the way.. i wrote the book on 'how aa failed others'... its the sequel to how aa failed you'.... check it out nigger! i was once a pig farmer full of demons.. and have been sent here to you to tell you all about it... so listen up kiddies.. its gonna be live!.... ye haaaaa!!!!!!!! bikerbabe loves alkies...


Member:
Location:
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 7:14:33 AM

Comments

bikerbaby girl, ya there?


Member: TUTOR FOR BARBARA
Location: BILL'S WONDERLAND
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 9:06:16 AM

Comments

Barbara V.,You better not ever say in a meeting what you just posted about not agreeing with everything that AA has to offer.You will be reprimanded.At least you have 100% free speech on this site to say what you want.Obviously you did not read all of the post that you are replying to.It was posted that AA is can be of good shock value when a drunk needs help the most,but sooner or later that drunk has to realize that it will require his own decision on whether to pickup the booze or not pick it up.It is all about choice as are all other areas of life.It takes a man to seek help and get better,but it takes a dumbass to hand over your brain and then defend the ones who did the taking.You do not make a very good point in stating that you enjoy the non drinkers company.If you want to be in better company then surely you can realize that by hanging out with former drunks,newly arrived drunks and drunks that relapse and wont be able to chair a meeting for 90 days is not the best choice for choosing not to be around the fallout of alcohol.Go to church,bowling,to the movies anywhere but continue to go hang with people with any ties to alcohol.By making a different choice you will increase your chances of being with truly non drinking people.If this view is considered poking your chest out then I am proud.People who drink in excessive amounts do need to let go of their need to control.Listen closely Barbara,they need to let go of their control over alcohol not control over their life and their ability to do better with their life.Now Barbara you be sure to print what you posted and make copies of it and give a copy to each person present at your next repetitive meeting.The newcomers will be somewhat relieved that they dont have to go along with everything.But and you know this to be true when the other members and oldtimers see what you posted you will be reprimanded,maybe not directly but you will feel one of the speakers wrath and that will make you draw your head back into the mole hole.NOW GET BACK IN LINE BARBARA AND WAIT YOUR TURN FOR YOUR MIRACLE,YES YOU KNOW IT,STICK AROUND FOR THE MIRACLE,YES KEEP COMING BACK


Member: J Dowson
Location: west yorkshire
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 10:00:49 AM

Comments

Hi everyone My mum is an alcoholic. for nine years now and she has gone too many aa meetings, but this week she has finally given up. she suffers from panic attacks and wen she drinks it causes panic. Monday just gone she gave up n threw all the alcohol in the bin but later that day i found all the lager was poured in a 2 litre bottle n i saw her drinking it. It honeslty broke my heart. Today my mum went out for some cigs n came back wi a bottle of vodka, she tried to bribe me but it dint work we argued and then she said " right come to the bathroom " i did, n she threw the whole contents of the bottle down the sink n i hav neva been so proud. I am 14 n i hav an elder brother n sister n a dad n we all live together n our family hav been through our ups and our downs but we are at the strongest now. And hope fully from as soon as possible i will be able to live a normal life which i havent done for over 9 years !!! i am sorry this isnt a comment on the topic but i just wanted to share my story with you.


Member: Chris H.
Location: Fla.
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 4:45:21 PM

Comments

I'm Chris-I'm an alcoholic/adict...The 11th step for me has been very helpful. I thought I was such a spiritual person before I came into A.A., but it is in these rooms that I really learned how much I was loved and forgiven by my Higher Power who I call God. I learned in here that that God is a God of 2nd chances and that it is never too late to start over. I learned that every day is a new day, and that is is never too late to start your day over again. I also have learned to leave the regrets of yesterday behind, and that the fears of tomorrow rarely happen. To day is a fresh day with my Higher Power, and what I need to focus on is gratitude for all the daily miracles that come my way. It is so very easy for me to fall into complaining and ingratitude...and discouragement. But I can pick up at any point and move into gratitude...and positive thinking and have hope. This program has taught me that the best way to stay sober ( and to move into gratitude ) is to help others. I am trying to build that into my life now.No matter how bad my life is, there is always someone wo is worse off than me and who can benifit from a word of encouragment. When I stay in the program I can have a measure of serenity. WHen I move out of it, I become self centered and unhappy. I have a lot to learn, but I have come a long way. And for that I am very greatful. I am greatful that my H. P. is a God of immense love and forgivenes. All He needs from us is a little honesty about ourselves. I am so greatful to the program of A.A> for teaching me these things.


Member: Connie S.
Location: Nashville, TN
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 4:47:54 PM

Comments

Hi Ya'll, I'm Connie a grateful, recovering alcoholic. God must be doing His thing and showing up through the people in these "rooms" because everyone sure shut-up the babble when J Dowson posted. Makes me grateful that's not my kid today because without this program, it could be. Have a great sober weekend everyone! Lets pray for the sick and suffering both inside and outside this program!


Member: Kevin
Location: Los Angeles
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 8:05:10 PM

Comments

Why so much anger towards AA? These shrill, angry, anti--AA comments don't make much sense. AA doesn't recruit, doesn't charge admission, doesn't solicit, etc. So if you don't like AA, God bless you, no one is asking you to like AA. But why on earth hang around AA chat rooms saying mean-spirited things about meetings, old timers, etc? Kind of sad. If you have a better way of life than AA, more power to you; but AA isn't doing any harm, we're just hanging out and sharing our strength and hope. No one recruited you into AA; you stumbled into some church basement or rehab all by yourself, and no one is trying to talk you into staying.


Member: NASHVILLE
Location: NASHVILLE
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 8:08:02 PM

Comments

CONNIE,MAYBE GOD CAN DO HIS THING IN NASHVILLE AND CURE YOU AND THEN MOVE ON TO THE NEXT CITY.HE WILL OR HE WONT.IF HE COULD THEN HE WOULD AND ALL WOULD BE WELL AND I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT DRUNKS WHO CHOOSE TO DESTROY THEIR OWN WELL BEING.I AM TALKING ABOUT ALL THE CHILDREN IN THE CANCER HOSPITALS,PEOPLE IN WHEELCHAIRS,PEOPLE WITH REAL DISEASES WHO HAVE NO CHOICE WITH WHAT LIFE THROWS THEIR WAY.ARE THESE PROBLEMS JUST TOO HARD FOR GOD TO FIX OR DOES HE PREFER THE EASY ONES ONLY THAT DRINK THE BOOZE.YEP GOD DO YOUR THING AND WAVE THAT WAND AND CURE ALL THAT AILS THE WORLD,AFTERALL YOU MADE EVERYTHING JUST SO AND SINCE YOU MADE CONNIE A GRATEFUL RECOVERING ALCOHOLIC GET HER WELL FIRST.WHILE YOU ARE AT IT GOD BRING ELVIS BACK,WE ALL MISS HIM SO MUCH.GET A LIFE CONNIE THAT YOU CAN BE TRULY GRATEFUL FOR INSTEAD OF PARROTING THOSE PHRASES THAT YOU HAVE BEEN ABLE TO MASTER.


Member: KEVIN'S INFORMER
Location: L.A.
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 8:13:06 PM

Comments

Kevin get your ass back in that basement.Does your sponsor know where you?


Member: Jeff K.-14 years
Location: Eastern Pennsylvania
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 8:31:54 PM

Comments

Hi all, havent been here for awhile and WOW is there a lot of BS in this room these days. Salty Dog i like your stuff. bikerbabe-thanks-i need to here from people like and am glad im not YOU. For the anti AAs, guess you couldnt get it and gave up and this is your way out. J Dawson sounds like part of my story, i know i put my kids through hell. hang in there kid and thanks for your input. Tutor for Barbara, Barbara doesnt need a tutor or to be reprimanded at a meeting, she needs to be taught how to stay sober. if i cant go to a meeting and say whats in my heart or on my mind whats the point ? BECKY,you didnt indicate weather or not you went to a second meeting, i hope you did. yes trying to manage it is dumb. find a WOMAN whose been sober awhile, ask questions (even the "dumb " ones, learn. youll get it if you want it, its your decision. thanks for listening, be good to yourselves, Blessed Be, Jeff


Member: 14 years later
Location: and I still have the same seat
Date: 8/16/2003
Time: 8:53:38 PM

Comments

Jeff after 14 years surely the program has cured you by now.Then again maybe your miracle has just come yet.Stick around for your miracle cause its coming and after wasting 14 years whats another year or two going to hurt.Keep coming back Jeff and oh yes if Barbara prints hwat she posted and distributes copies of it she will experience just what I said she will and you know that to be true Jeff.Now get back in line Jeff and wait your turn for your miracle.


Member: yo-yo
Location: maybe NY
Date: 8/17/2003
Time: 12:23:16 AM

Comments

a hug for ((((((bikerbabe))))))


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: 8/17/2003
Time: 12:48:31 AM

Comments

To everyone here, I'm sorry I threw names at the many named no named person. That shows I need to work on my character defects. Namely fear by retaliating. I just miss the peace that is normally here but AA is open to anyone and all opinions. Who am I to ask for it to stop? I'm going on a year sober but I'll always be an alcoholic. It does not matter what anyone else says because that is my experience. AA saved my life, God removed my obsession to drink and meetings keep me plugged in and are very enjoyable. Could I have stopped drinking on my own? Absolutely not! Am I cured? No, I have a daily reprieve based on my spiritual condition. Is drinking a choice?, not for me. I was a black out drinker from 13, before it ever was a choice. All I know is my life has totally turned around for the better. I would hope I never take the credit for what God and AA did for me, made me a sober woman. I have one very important thing now and that is hope. Hope for a happy sober future. I come here for others experience, strength and hope like I get at meetings. I just can't relate to why we need to slam the hand that feeds/ fed us? Nothing anyone can say will make me abandon the one thing that did work for me and save my sorry life. Sorry to tripple dip this week which is against the rules. I just wanted to share that I hope I never get so well I want to kill what saved my life...


Member: Bikerbabe has been to hell... i repeat bikerbabe has seen hell
Location: hang on to your frocks people. this one's a shocker!
Date: 8/17/2003
Time: 1:06:18 AM

Comments

Hey i gotta question. i was doing my usual 'porn surf the other night and i can't help but notice that men really love that 'nasty' element when engaged in the sex act. They say things like "oh ya baby' your a nasty little whore and so forth and so on.. now i wonder,, what is this male facination with us women being "bad "dirty "nasty and hard core?... is that so that they can have a 'justification' for treating us as lowly as they seem to do in the porn flicks?.. just curious guys... and btw.. what say of these women! or should i call them "volunteer victims".. yes i have a whole new and genuine disrespect for women now. pretty gross. i mean porn is porn, and sex is sex.. so what?... but come on.. this 'violent edge' is so prevelant... there was one on there about a grandpa who gets a bj from grandaughter, and then punches her in the face for not swallowing... no kidding!... pretty sick stuff eh?.. needless to say i didn't download that one... hopefully its illegal.. well nuf!...HEY~! who was that who suggested to go to the porn site again?.. hey thanx eh?...


Member: Babe to yo yo......
Location:
Date: 8/17/2003
Time: 1:11:49 AM

Comments

oh ya... almost forgot... yo yo... great big hug back to you.... (kissy wissy) smotchie gotchie.. wotchie... ha ha..ha..i hope your smiling sweetheart....brak brack


Member: For Kelly M.
Location: YOU MADE YOURSELF SOBER BY BEING RESPONSIBLE
Date: 8/17/2003
Time: 1:33:31 AM

Comments

Kelly M.,girl do I have a wonderful idea for you.Since GOD removed your obsesssion to drink why dont you ask him to remove your character defects and your crutch being AA MEETINGS and just make you Snow White.Sorry that AA creates a blurred alternative to realities of life.Why you are at ask God to make peace not just on this site,but hey real hot spots like Iraq,Israel,Liberia. Those guru's must have issued A PAIR OF THOSE TRIFOCAL ROSE COLORED GLASSES. Yes you and you only can take credit for not choosing to drink the poison that consumed your life.AA was good for the initial shock therapy that you more than likely needed.But you have swallowed the AA DOGMA hook,line and sinker.Shit girl you picked up a set of crutches and the rose colored trifocal glasses.I bet you have enough chips to host a poker tournament and more pins than a 4 star general